NYJetsFan.com Forums: Herman Edwards Making All Kinds Of Mistakes! - NYJetsFan.com Forums

Jump to content

Toggle shoutbox NYJETSFAN BANTER

FANTASY FOOTBALL SIGN UP: http://nyjetsfan.com...ndpost&p=357345
Jetsfan0099 Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:09 PM) So 1 preseason game after being out for a while, you want to just dump him?
Jetsfan0099 Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:09 PM) His coverage wasn't even that bad, he was there just didn't make the plays. Allen Robinson is a stud too
Jetsfan0099 Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:10 PM) Lets see how he does in future games, rather him make mistakes in a vanilla preseason game
RetireChrebet Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:10 PM) It's hard for me to get excited about Forte. I have a feeling Bilal will have a breakout year. Likely do to increased workload and improved Oline
RetireChrebet Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:11 PM) Due
ganggreen2003 Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:15 PM) hell let's cut geno too
RetireChrebet Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:16 PM) I agree. Trade Genome
RetireChrebet Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:18 PM) trade Geno, take anything you can get for him, even if it's a 7th round pick. The future is Petty or Hack. If not draft another QB in a couple years.
ganggreen2003 Icon : (13 August 2016 - 12:21 PM) what team would want a QB who got suckerpunched by a 3rd stringer last year in training camp
azjetfan Icon : (13 August 2016 - 05:03 PM) The Cowboys may trade a player or a pick for Geno. With Romo being brittle and them having zero depth I could see them giving something.
azjetfan Icon : (13 August 2016 - 05:04 PM) I'm really not an anti Geno guy though. If he can mature he can play in this league. He has the physical talents but lacks the drive.
santana Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:06 PM) I doubt anyone trades for geno
santana Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:07 PM) jets would get like a 6th rounder for him his value would be better on the bench
Chaos Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:25 PM) yes, yes, let's cut the former 9th overall pick because he had a poor preseason game and deal with a no good $4M cap hit.
Chaos Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:26 PM) who would you sign to be #2? or do you seriously think petty is good for the job?
santana Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:37 PM) the backup is always ready for the job is the jets fan mantra
santana Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:46 PM) I need a backup
santana Icon : (13 August 2016 - 06:46 PM) WHERES MY BACKUP
vjdbbq Icon : (15 August 2016 - 07:52 AM) Would someone scratch bobrob42 ?
ROBJETS Icon : (16 August 2016 - 03:33 AM) Az..... Apparently you didn't watch the Cowboys preseason game. Romo didn't play and their current backup played a good bit with starters and backups and he looked great. Almost like a veteran. They would have 0 interest in trading for Geno now.
vjdbbq Icon : (16 August 2016 - 01:57 PM) ROB is back ; ,how's the ass ?
Chaos Icon : (18 August 2016 - 12:18 PM) we need 1 more for fantasy football!
Jetsfan115 Icon : (19 August 2016 - 06:27 PM) game stream http://ifirstrowus.e...-york-jets.html
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 07:06 PM) defense is playing like shit
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:00 PM) Geno still sucks
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:08 PM) Petty 9/15 120 yards and a TD
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:27 PM) Sudfeld sucks 2 fumbles
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:28 PM) petty had then in the red zone going for the go ahead score
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:31 PM) OK we at the wash 42
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:32 PM) WOOOO TD!!
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:32 PM) f*** you Geno. Lets keep Petty
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:40 PM) Petty 15/24 230 yards and 2 TDs
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:40 PM) Geno 6/13 1Int
MikeGangGree... Icon : (19 August 2016 - 09:46 PM) BOOOO we lose
santana Icon : (20 August 2016 - 09:29 AM) I was at the game and I thought fitz looked like crapola
vjdbbq Icon : (21 August 2016 - 01:01 PM) You were looking at GENO !!!!!!!!!!!
santana Icon : (21 August 2016 - 02:24 PM) you have a crush on geno don't you
santana Icon : (21 August 2016 - 02:24 PM) it's ok
ganggreen2003 Icon : (21 August 2016 - 07:10 PM) WTF is taking so long to cut geno and milliner
ganggreen2003 Icon : (21 August 2016 - 07:10 PM) they both are bums and need to go away
Chaos Icon : (22 August 2016 - 08:29 AM) it makes zero sense to cut them.
Chaos Icon : (22 August 2016 - 08:30 AM) this isn't fantasy. cutting players has an impact on the cap.
Jetsfan115 Icon : (22 August 2016 - 10:20 AM) becuase we need them
Chaos Icon : (Yesterday, 11:25 AM) DRAFT UPDATE:

Date: Tuesday August 30, 2016
Time: 8:00 pm
Jetsfan115 Icon : (Yesterday, 02:20 PM) cap stuff http://nyjetsfan.com...showtopic=38899
Resize Shouts Area

  • (3 Pages)
  • +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • This topic is locked

Herman Edwards Making All Kinds Of Mistakes! Jets are too.....

#1 User is offline   richkotite2006 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 153
  • Joined: 19-November 05
  • Gender:Male

  • NFL Team:

Posted 19 January 2006 - 08:06 PM

1. KC needs Defensive help. So he allows Al Saunders his offensive coordinator sign with Washington today.

2. He keeps a horrible Gunther Cunningham as Defensive Coordinator.

3. He alienates Priest Holmes and gives away his cards by announcing Larry Johnson as the starter. In January..great strategy Herm. Summer workouts won't be as intense because they are not working toward any goals.

4. Dick Curl is on his staff as clock guru.

Meanwhile...with the Jets


Eric Mangini is getting rid of all the black coaches. I saw the picture of the 5 crackers running our team. I hope he keeps a diverse team. One thing is for sure the coaching staff went Anglo in a hurry!
0

#2 User is offline   JerseyJet Icon

  • LB Coach
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 1,541
  • Joined: 16-January 06
  • Location:Central Jersey
  • Interests:Jets Football, Rutgers Football, NFL football History Buff, making fun of Patriots fans. Reading about WWII/Civil war/Jets, playing drums, guitar, listening to the who, led zeppelin and pink floyd.<br /><br />Favorite player- Jon Vilma<br /><br /><br /><br />NYJETSFAN.COM ,Phillies baseball, Minor League Baseball, College Football, football card collecting,baseball card collecting<br />Favorite Philly- , Aaron Rowand<br />Arena Football, baseball card collecting.<br />Drinking Rootbeer,baseball and football video games, baseball, football,playing football and baseball, music, favorite band- the who, song- won't get fooled again.<br />Bands-The who<br />led zeppelin,pink floyd

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 19 January 2006 - 08:32 PM

Race dosn't mean anything! I am sure going to miss Donnie and Herm though.
IPB Image
IPB Image
Keep Choppin Jets, Phillies and Knights!
0

#3 User is offline   CrazyHorseDave Icon

  • D Coordinator
  • Icon
  • Group: Moderator
  • Posts: 2,071
  • Joined: 30-March 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Jersey

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 19 January 2006 - 08:40 PM

QUOTE (richkotite2006 @ Jan 19 2006, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
....
Eric Mangini is getting rid of all the black coaches. I saw the picture of the 5 crackers running our team. I hope he keeps a diverse team. One thing is for sure the coaching staff went Anglo in a hurry!



im watchin you focker dance.gif
0

#4 User is offline   richkotite2006 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 153
  • Joined: 19-November 05
  • Gender:Male

  • NFL Team:

Posted 19 January 2006 - 09:02 PM

I guess the truth hurts.
0

#5 User is offline   theanalogkid Icon

  • D Coordinator
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2,913
  • Joined: 26-October 05

  • NFL Team:

Posted 19 January 2006 - 09:09 PM

That last line gave me a little laugh, but I doubt Magnini is racist.
...no hero in your tradgey, no daring in your escape, no salutes to your surrender, nothing noble in your fate....Rush, The Pass.

0

#6 User is offline   richkotite2006 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 153
  • Joined: 19-November 05
  • Gender:Male

  • NFL Team:

Posted 19 January 2006 - 09:33 PM

I just want the team to be more diverse.
0

#7 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

  • Group: Guests

Posted 19 January 2006 - 09:34 PM

Ok, can we please ban this guy now, he is now getting racial into his posts, he really needs to leave. It's obvious nobody likes him around here.
0

#8 User is offline   oracle401 Icon

  • LB Coach
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 1,056
  • Joined: 04-April 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bronx, NY

  • NFL Team:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 01:01 AM

QUOTE (richkotite2006 @ Jan 20 2006, 07:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I just want the team to be more diverse.


And that's cool. So do I, and so do I think most people rooting for the Jets. But just because those people hired are white, doesn't mean a whole lot. It could just mean Mangini thought those "crackers" were the best qualified.

By the way, I'm white, and I say cracker all the time. biggrin.gif
0

#9 User is offline   matt x Icon

  • LB Coach
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 1,138
  • Joined: 22-July 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:upstate ny (work in L.I, NJ,&CT.
  • Interests:family, jets, mets, grateful dead.

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 06:54 AM

I am not familiar with the word "cracker", please enlighten me.
Posted Image
0

#10 User is offline   jetman18 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 120
  • Joined: 30-March 05
  • Location:Sussex County NJ. GO WV Rangers!
  • Interests:Height: Not Enough<br />Weight: I'm thinking<br />Sex: Sometimes<br /> Hobby: Bashing Fireman Ed!<br />Favorite Food: Wax lips<br />Favorite Drink: Razzle Berry dressing<br />Favorite Color: Yes<br />Favorite Animal: Eric Burden<br />Favorite Song : La La La La La Fa La La La!<br />Favorite Day: Tommorrow

  • NFL Team:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 08:31 AM

I was wondering what happened to Jetbag, I see he crawled out from under his rock with a new name!
Tailgating, not just a hobby, BUT a way of LIFE!

President; jetman18 Fan Club


0

#11 User is offline   Canuck Jet Icon

  • Special Teams
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 205
  • Joined: 21-June 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Toronto

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 09:59 AM

QUOTE (richkotite2006 @ Jan 19 2006, 09:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Meanwhile...with the Jets
Eric Mangini is getting rid of all the black coaches. I saw the picture of the 5 crackers running our team. I hope he keeps a diverse team. One thing is for sure the coaching staff went Anglo in a hurry!



Rich, I thought last week you were saying that Herm was hired because of affirmative action. Now you want to keep the coaching staff more diversified? Please tell me that your just takin the piss.

Cracker n : a poor white person in the southern US [syn: redneck]

The origins of the term are uncertain. the term may have come from the word corncracker, which describes someone who cracks corn for liquor, a common practice especially in early Appalachia. Wilton writes, "The song lyric 'Jimmy Crack Corn' is a reference to this. In the song, a slave sings about how his master got drunk, fell, hit his head, and died. And the slave 'don't care.' (This was a pretty subversive song for its day.) This usage, however, is probably not the origin of the ethnic term cracker"

Clarence Major, in his Dictionary of Afro-American Slang, lists an interesting idea about the origin of the term. The first is that a "cracker" was a slang term used by 19th Century Georgian slaves to refer to the slavemasters. If this were in fact, true, then the term would come directly from the cracking of the slavemaster's whip. This is quite a peculiar theory, because it would immediately explain the negative connotation that the word has taken. However, there seems to be little or no support for this theory, and no other source that was studied mentions it.

Before the Milwaukee Braves baseball team moved to Atlanta, the Atlanta minor league baseball team was known as the "Atlanta Crackers." The team existed under this name from 1901 until 1965. They were members of the Southern Association from their inception until 1961, and members of the International League from 1961 until they were moved to Richmond, Virginia in 1965. Ironically, an Atlanta team in Negro League Baseball was known as the Atlanta "Black Crackers."


thats enough etymology and historical trivia for one day!
Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come.

-Matt Groening
0

#12 User is offline   oracle401 Icon

  • LB Coach
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 1,056
  • Joined: 04-April 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bronx, NY

  • NFL Team:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 10:03 AM

QUOTE (Canuck Jet @ Jan 20 2006, 08:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Rich, I thought last week you were saying that Herm was hired because of affirmative action. Now you want to keep the coaching staff more diversified? Please tell me that your just takin the piss.

Cracker n : a poor white person in the southern US [syn: redneck]

The origins of the term are uncertain. the term may have come from the word corncracker, which describes someone who cracks corn for liquor, a common practice especially in early Appalachia. Wilton writes, "The song lyric 'Jimmy Crack Corn' is a reference to this. In the song, a slave sings about how his master got drunk, fell, hit his head, and died. And the slave 'don't care.' (This was a pretty subversive song for its day.) This usage, however, is probably not the origin of the ethnic term cracker"

Clarence Major, in his Dictionary of Afro-American Slang, lists an interesting idea about the origin of the term. The first is that a "cracker" was a slang term used by 19th Century Georgian slaves to refer to the slavemasters. If this were in fact, true, then the term would come directly from the cracking of the slavemaster's whip. This is quite a peculiar theory, because it would immediately explain the negative connotation that the word has taken. However, there seems to be little or no support for this theory, and no other source that was studied mentions it.

Before the Milwaukee Braves baseball team moved to Atlanta, the Atlanta minor league baseball team was known as the "Atlanta Crackers." The team existed under this name from 1901 until 1965. They were members of the Southern Association from their inception until 1961, and members of the International League from 1961 until they were moved to Richmond, Virginia in 1965. Ironically, an Atlanta team in Negro League Baseball was known as the Atlanta "Black Crackers."
thats enough etymology and historical trivia for one day!


That was very informative, thank you. funny.gif I like thought of a slave owner dying from head trauma.
0

#13 Guest_a1elbow_*

  • Group: Guests

Posted 20 January 2006 - 10:21 AM

Good stuff Canuck Jet.

On the main point of the article, don't you say that "Donnie needed to go" in another topic Rich? Considering that you belive so, and that the other coaches who were let go were in charge of underperforming units, I don't see how you could honestly believe that race played any part in it.

If you are just saying we need to be careful, I agree. While I don't believe race plays any part in Mangini's or the team's thought process they still need to be careful that the public doesn't get that impression.
0

#14 User is offline   jetman18 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 120
  • Joined: 30-March 05
  • Location:Sussex County NJ. GO WV Rangers!
  • Interests:Height: Not Enough<br />Weight: I'm thinking<br />Sex: Sometimes<br /> Hobby: Bashing Fireman Ed!<br />Favorite Food: Wax lips<br />Favorite Drink: Razzle Berry dressing<br />Favorite Color: Yes<br />Favorite Animal: Eric Burden<br />Favorite Song : La La La La La Fa La La La!<br />Favorite Day: Tommorrow

  • NFL Team:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 10:22 AM

Unfortunately, I believe the term "Cracker" is a degrogatory term used to describe a "white" person. AKA Whip "Cracker" "Slave owner" I don't believe that believe that mr richkotite2006 meant it as friendly term. Maybe Mr RK2006 can refrain from using the "Cracker" term on this site. Any derogatory term used towards ANY Race is UNACCEPTABLE!!!!! Jetbag knows this!
Tailgating, not just a hobby, BUT a way of LIFE!

President; jetman18 Fan Club


0

#15 User is offline   NJAzrael71 Icon

  • Formerly FlyHi
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 3,664
  • Joined: 06-August 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NJ

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 10:54 AM

This asswipe definitely needs to go. The only reason he posts anymore is to incite something to cause trouble knowing that his posts are inflamatory.

What the hell does the fact that he's letting Donnie go have to do with race? Mangini was the DC in New England. I'm thinking his philosophy is different than that of Donnie, so rather than bumping heads, he released him to pursue a position elsewhere.

I don't like the decision myself as I think Donnie wa sdoing a great job with this Defense, but I'm not about to go accusing the man of being a racist without having something to back up my statements unlike some other people here that need to be on a permanent ban. Ban his IP address already!! Although the numbskull is probably on dial up therefore has an ever changing IP.
I will not be forgotten. This is my time to shine. I've got the scars to prove it. Only the strong survive.

When someone annoys u, it takes 42 muscles in ur face 2 frown. BUT, it only takes 4 muscles 2 extend ur arm & b!tch-slap that mother@*?!&! upside the head!!
0

#16 User is offline   iriedevil32 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 70
  • Joined: 14-June 05
  • Location:Indianapolis, IN/ Yonkers, NY

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 12:05 PM

Cracker was originally a pejorative term for a white person, mainly used in the Southern United States. In recent years (as of 2006), the term has gained some currency as a prideful or jocular self-description. With the huge influx of new residents from the North, the term "Cracker" is now used informally by some white residents of Florida and Georgia ("Florida cracker" or "Georgia cracker") to indicate that their family has lived there for many generations. (The term "White Cracker" is usually not used self referentially and remains a slur.) Usage of the term "Cracker" generally differs from Hick and Hillbilly, because Crackers reject or resist assimilation into the dominant culture, while Hicks and Hillbillies theoretically are isolated from the dominant culture. In this way, the Cracker is similar to the Redneck.

As an insult, cracker was and is used most frequently in the South, especially in Georgia and Florida. It is invoked typically against poor, white Americans without formal education and of rural backgrounds.-

However, today the term is commonly used as a racial epithet against white people throughout the US, regardless of socio-economic status, ethnicity or geographic origins.


Etymology
There are various theories about the origin of the term "cracker." The term has been traced to the 1760s, when it was used by the Earl of Dartmouth to refer to frontiersmen who were "great boasters." It may be derived from the Gaelic "craic," meaning "entertaining conversation."

A folk etymology claims the term cracker originated from piney-woods Georgia and Florida pastoral yeomen's use of whips to drive cattle. The word then came to be associated with the cattlemen of Georgia and Florida.

Other theories include references to cracking a whip over oxen when driving cotton to market, the 18th century practice of cracking corn to make liquor, or to poor whites having had to crack their grain because they couldn't afford to take it to the local mill to have it ground. Others suggest that "cracker" derives from the white overseers who cracked the whip to intimidate black slaves. There may also be another possible origin - the first residents of Georgia were British convicts. In this setting the word takes on an illegal or criminal context. The term was used by Charles Darwin in The Origin of Species to refer to "Virginia squatters" (illegal settlers).

QUOTE
"cracker

QUOTE
"cracker

0

#17 User is offline   S-Dubb Icon

  • 2008 Best Insider Award
  • Icon
  • View blog
  • Group: Assistant Admin
  • Posts: 31,145
  • Joined: 02-May 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:---
  • Interests:Hardcore Jets & Knicks fan - Gym rat - health and nutrition - family man and proud father.

    Twitter: @NYJETSFANCOM

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 12:45 PM

Hey I got an idea!!!!. How about we GET OFF of the Herm Edwards talk's and topic's. I don't think any Jet fan give 2 shit's what he's doing now and for somebody who hated Herm you sure do keep bringing him up.

He must be on your mind.
crazy.gif
0

#18 User is offline   reg83ny Icon

  • TMZ Correspondent
  • Icon
  • Group: Moderator
  • Posts: 4,591
  • Joined: 30-March 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Beantown...I missed NY

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 12:47 PM

QUOTE (jetman18 @ Jan 20 2006, 09:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I was wondering what happened to Jetbag, I see he crawled out from under his rock with a new name!


Don't ever compare this fool to Jetfannobagoverhead.
0

#19 User is offline   richkotite2006 Icon

  • Drafted Rookie
  • Icon
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 153
  • Joined: 19-November 05
  • Gender:Male

  • NFL Team:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 12:49 PM

Lets see...Eric Mangini gets hired and he's white. He fires 2 black coaches and keeps the 1 white coach. The black defensive coordinator was far superior than the white offensive coordinator in every possible statistic.
The white offesnive coordinator doesn't even want to be there! He should have fired everyone!

It is all about race. Only those people who dismiss it are the ones that are blind and do not want to see.

Head Coaching Hires

Jets: Mangini is white
Saints: Payton is white
Lions: Marinelli is white
Packers: MCarthy is white
Vikings: Childress is white
Bills: To be determined white person
Rams: Linehan is white
Texans: to be determined white person
Raiders: to be determined white person

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that everyone is afraid to hire a black head coach becuase Herman Edwards burned bridges.
0

#20 User is offline   Smedsthejet Icon

  • Assistant Head Coach
  • Icon
  • Group: Moderator
  • Posts: 8,293
  • Joined: 10-April 05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:London, England

  • NFL Team:

  • MLB:

Posted 20 January 2006 - 12:56 PM

I think he meant the crackers are Bradway, Tennenbaum, Woody Johnson, Mangini and Jay Cross



QUOTE (richkotite2006 @ Jan 20 2006, 06:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Lets see...Eric Mangini gets hired and he's white. He fires 2 black coaches and keeps the 1 white coach. The black defensive coordinator was far superior than the white offensive coordinator in every possible statistic.
The white offesnive coordinator doesn't even want to be there! He should have fired everyone!

It is all about race. Only those people who dismiss it are the ones that are blind and do not want to see.

Head Coaching Hires

Jets: Mangini is white
Saints: Payton is white
Lions: Marinelli is white
Packers: MCarthy is white
Vikings: Childress is white
Bills: To be determined white person
Rams: Linehan is white
Texans: to be determined white person
Raiders: to be determined white person

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that everyone is afraid to hire a black head coach becuase Herman Edwards burned bridges.


What about Dungy, Edwards, Lovie Smith, Marvin Lewis, Denny Green and Romeo Crennel then? Shut up about race because nowadays it isn't an issue in HC hiring. Tim Lewis, Ron Rivera,Donnie, Mike Singletary and Jim Gray are just a few guys who are hispanic or black that will probably be HCs soon and all (and others) were interviewed for the current vacancies.
0

  • (3 Pages)
  • +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • This topic is locked

1 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users