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The Official STFU About the Pats Thread! ... And Brady vs Manning

#21 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 12:09 PM

WRONG! Because it's a team game... you said so yourself. No body would say Brady is a better QB than Manning. Manning has beaten Brady like 3 times in a row now.
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#22 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 12:24 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 12:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
WRONG! Because it's a team game... you said so yourself. No body would say Brady is a better QB than Manning. Manning has beaten Brady like 3 times in a row now.


you contradict yourself. first you say oh you can't say that its Brady because its a team game, but then you say that Manning has beaten Brady 3 times in a row, like they are playing each other one on one.

all I have to point to is the fact that you said Brady doesn't make his WR better to make the point that you just don't like Brady and are making these arguments based on that.

I hate Brady too, but I see how good he has played.

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 11:14 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
WRONG! Caldwell was atleast catching passes out in SD. Kelly Washington? Come on. TRASH! Doesn't matter. Stallworth.... maybe an upgrade, maybe not. Welker? Come on, how is he better than Caldwell? They're the same nagging type of player.

It's not something we need to sit and complain about is what I'm telling you. These WR's are trash! TRASH TRASH TRASH TRASH TRASH!!!!! With the exception of Welker cause I like him but he's nothing special either. He's just gonna be a good player, but certainly not a guy we need to gameplan. Some of you need to pull it together. Tom Brady isn't Manning or Montana, he doesn't MAKE WR's good. So don't get that confused because when it comes to being a prolific QB Tom Brady certainly isn't in that category IMO.


you take your prolific manning, and i'll take 3 championships
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#23 User is offline   Smedsthejet Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 12:25 PM

To be honest Pioli is just bowing to his QBs demands as Brady was basically kicking and screaming when the Pats traded Deion Branch to Seattle. What does that cause the Pats to do? Go out and sign 2 average and 1 below average (Washington) WR all for relatively big money even though Washington has a small signing bonus compared with salary. That to me is a sign of desparation.
Brady will make Welker a better player but it's not as if he was a TD machine in Miami. He can do for them what Chrebet did for us plus Welker is a solid Special Teams guy but that kind of player doesn't merit the big contract, 2nd and 7th round picks IMO. Stallworth also hasn't produced enough in his career to warrant the payday he has just received. They added two solid WRs but didn't get value for money in my eyes as they had to pay over the odds for both.
Belichick probably views Washington as a reclamation project but he had little success with turning Bethel Johnson into any sort of threat on offense and Chad Jackson couldn't beat out Caldwell or Gaffney this year which shows Belichick isn't invincible when it comes to turning 2nd round picks (which Welker basically is) into solid players. Brady did make Gaffney and Caldwell look good but they didn't produce when required as one of the two, Caldwell I think, dropped a pass in the endzone in the AFC Championship. If Belichick thinks he has found a Branch or even Givens calibre player in those three then he is slightly off the mark in my eyes as neither has played to the level as Branch or Givens yet in their careers.
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#24 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 12:30 PM

No, the point I'm making is these poopoo WR's they've signed aren't as good as everyone wants to make them out to be. Brady isn't as good as Manning and there aren't many that would disagree since Manning finally won a Superbowl.

Hell remember Steve Young? Same thing, great QB but couldn't get a ring. Finally got one and then he's HOF and one of the best QBs of the common era. I wouldn't say Brady is better than Young by any stretch. I would say Manning is because I think he'll be the best QB ever for starters. Not only that but all that he's accomplished already.... all the broken records.... Manning is a better QB. Come on dude.

You're right I hate Brady. But I respect him too. However, I don't respect him enough to say he's gonna turn poo into gold. He's not Rumplestilskin you know? More like RinkledStinkSkin....
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#25 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 12:54 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 01:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No, the point I'm making is these poopoo WR's they've signed aren't as good as everyone wants to make them out to be. Brady isn't as good as Manning and there aren't many that would disagree since Manning finally won a Superbowl.

Hell remember Steve Young? Same thing, great QB but couldn't get a ring. Finally got one and then he's HOF and one of the best QBs of the common era. I wouldn't say Brady is better than Young by any stretch. I would say Manning is because I think he'll be the best QB ever for starters. Not only that but all that he's accomplished already.... all the broken records.... Manning is a better QB. Come on dude.

You're right I hate Brady. But I respect him too. However, I don't respect him enough to say he's gonna turn poo into gold. He's not Rumplestilskin you know? More like RinkledStinkSkin....


I hate brady too, but to say that he's not better than Manning. And not only that, you said they are not even on the same level. no one in their right mind would say that. Except someone who's hating.

hell, even when Manning won the championship, he didn't even play too well throughout the playoffs.
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#26 User is offline   gmany3k Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 12:55 PM

I think Brady is the better QB .he makes it look easy no matter whom the pats field.
Manning has had to dominate every play and he worked his ass off in the process.
this year he stepped into the realm of Brady making it look easy no matter the personnel on the field.
the mark of a great football player.best ever QB... there never is its always a different era.
21ST CENTURY NEW YORK STATE OF MIND ."REST IN PEACE NIGHT OWL TOM"Use Caution when reading my comments>.Posted Image
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#27 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:15 PM

Brady's never played GREAT, he just kept winning. He played good, sometimes well enough. Mostly with just enough help from the defense. That's what I'm saying. He's not gonna make those 3 WR's any better than they already are which is mediocre in their best case which is Stallworth. That's what I'm saying.
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#28 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:27 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 01:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Brady's never played GREAT, he just kept winning. He played good, sometimes well enough. Mostly with just enough help from the defense. That's what I'm saying. He's not gonna make those 3 WR's any better than they already are which is mediocre in their best case which is Stallworth. That's what I'm saying.


1st off Brady has played Great, to say that he hasn't played great is saying that you haven't watched him play. we can do a poll if you want to ask if Brady has played Great. And you have the nerve to say NEVER played great. you are not being truthful.
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#29 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:30 PM

You have your story I have mine. I don't think he's good enough to make 3 so so WR's into God's of the NFL Field. You're going off onto sub topics I wish not venture. No I also have never been impressed with Brady besides 1 or two throws in the clutch.
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#30 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:30 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 01:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No, the point I'm making is these poopoo WR's they've signed aren't as good as everyone wants to make them out to be. Brady isn't as good as Manning and there aren't many that would disagree since Manning finally won a Superbowl.

Hell remember Steve Young? Same thing, great QB but couldn't get a ring. Finally got one and then he's HOF and one of the best QBs of the common era. I wouldn't say Brady is better than Young by any stretch. I would say Manning is because I think he'll be the best QB ever for starters. Not only that but all that he's accomplished already.... all the broken records.... Manning is a better QB. Come on dude.

You're right I hate Brady. But I respect him too. However, I don't respect him enough to say he's gonna turn poo into gold. He's not Rumplestilskin you know? More like RinkledStinkSkin....


2nd. Many would disagree that Manning is better than Brady.

put it like this would you like a QB who has led his team to 1 championship and lots of records or 3 championships. Most people take 3 championships without hesitation. So, i don't know what you are saying.
And we all know that Brady led his team to 3 championships and Manning led hims team to 1. (and I even give it to manning even though he didn't play to well in the playoffs)
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#31 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:32 PM

QUOTE (triple3s @ Mar 13 2007, 03:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
2nd. Many would disagree that Manning is better than Brady.

put it like this would you like a QB who has led his team to 1 championship and lots of records or 3 championships. Most people take 3 championships without hesitation. So, i don't know what you are saying.
And we all know that Brady led his team to 3 championships and Manning led hims team to 1. (and I even give it to manning even though he didn't play to well in the playoffs)


You are being SOOOO unfair and biased. Manning has had to play with a horrible Defense. Brady gets the best Defense in the league. That's gonna make his chances of getting a Superbowl victory much greater than Mannings. You gotta be objective here.
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#32 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:34 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 02:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You have your story I have mine. I don't think he's good enough to make 3 so so WR's into God's of the NFL Field. You're going off onto sub topics I wish not venture. No I also have never been impressed with Brady besides 1 or two throws in the clutch.


No one ever said he was going to turn them into God, I said that he makes his recievers better. You said that he does not make his wr better. You're the one who brought up manning. and regardless, even if you feel that manning is better. you're telling me that the second best QB in the league doesn't make his wr's better?
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#33 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:37 PM

QUOTE (triple3s @ Mar 13 2007, 03:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No one ever said he was going to turn them into God, I said that he makes his recievers better. You said that he does not make his wr better. You're the one who brought up manning. and regardless, even if you feel that manning is better. you're telling me that the second best QB in the league doesn't make his wr's better?


I'm saying how much better can you make these guys? Stallworth is TRASH! Washington is TRASH! Welker has potential but he's nothing to shake in our boots about.


You are missing the point, I'm gonna have to make sure you don't miss it this time.


These WR's ARE NOT as good as you guys are making them out be. They ARE NOT going to be great merely because they are going to the Patriots.
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#34 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:38 PM

Seems like Jetson and I have a major disagreement and would like to get some other input.

First off he says that Brady doesn't make his wr's better. 2nd that manning is better than Brady. I disagree with both.

I hate Brady, but being unbiased, its seems clear to me that Brady has 3 rings and led his team to those and has been more clutch(which can't be measured in stats), while Manning has put up stats and has not been good under pressure. Even in this years playoffs he wasn't spectacular. But i'm curious what everyone esle things. I'm sure jetson can clarify anything if he wants.
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#35 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:39 PM

You really had to make this a thread?........
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#36 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:43 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 02:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm saying how much better can you make these guys? Stallworth is TRASH! Washington is TRASH! Welker has potential but he's nothing to shake in our boots about.
You are missing the point, I'm gonna have to make sure you don't miss it this time.
These WR's ARE NOT as good as you guys are making them out be. They ARE NOT going to be great merely because they are going to the Patriots.



lol. first of all relax. second of all you said that brady won't make them better, so even if they are trash, they will be better.

secondly stallworth is not trash, he has been injured, but he's a good wr. not great, but good. welker has played very well the past 2 years without a QB, and that's a big difference than playing with Tom Brady. And kelly washington has potential, he had to play behind great wide recievers in Cincy, and he was very good in college. and even when he got on the field in cincy he was pretty good.

3rd. look what the patriots offense did with no name wide recievers last year? If the guys they acquired are trash, what were their recievers last year? because stallworth is def better than all of them for a fact and wes welker is better IMO. New englands pass offense was still good last year. it did well with them. so what will they do with better WR's? Well, we feel that they will be even better in the passing game.

its that simple. no one said anythign about them being God or anything like that, but they are definitely not trash like you say. and they upgraded their passing game.
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#37 User is offline   triple3s Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:46 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Mar 13 2007, 02:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You really had to make this a thread?........

why not see what everyone else thinks? that so bad?
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#38 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:48 PM

They aren't anything special is what I'm saying. The fact I had to make a thread to talk about 3 FA aquisitions by the Patriots that are nothing more than "Who gives a shit?" is a problem. These guys aren't anything more than backups. Welker has potential but not anything spectacular. The others HAD potential but did nothing with it. That's what I'm saying.
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#39 User is offline   ganggreen_ewok Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:48 PM

What is this, open mike night? No one really cares, because frankly, both of you could argue this shit into the ground. Ridiculous topic poopbanana.gif

Truth is, Manning is more productive and Brady's 3 rings were also behind superb defenses. Where's the superb Indy defense?

QUOTE (triple3s @ Mar 13 2007, 02:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
why not see what everyone else thinks? that so bad?

Yes it is poopbanana.gif

View Postganggreen_ewok, on 13 June 2011 - 07:43 PM, said:

"And once again, the meow became a roar"


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#40 User is offline   Pennington Icon

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:57 PM

Well my unbiased opinion is that Manning is the better QUARTERBACK.

Lets not underestimate the coaching in New England. Those guys simply outsmart everybody.

I can hardly argue that either is a harder worker because we both know they each work hard.
But what I can tell you on pure skills alone is that Peyton is unquestionably better.

As far as elevating those around him, I would lean towards Brady. We have become accustomed to the idea that Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne are studs..but couldnt we argue that Peyton made them studs?

Lets analyze for a moment:
Peyton became the starting QB in 1998 and threw for 3700 yards.
Marvin was on pace for his FIRST 1000 yard season that very same year.
Marvin caught the ball 115 times for 1600 yards in Peytons second season..the year Peyton got comfortable.
Reggie as a 4th year receiver finally had his breakout with 1200 yards on 77 receptions as the #2.

Marvin was good before Peyton came..but you cant argue that he didnt become elite after Peyton arrived. Regardless of who you think is responsible.

Im not sure the Pats have even had a 1000 yard receiver in the last 5 years..so has Brady really made anyone better? Or is he in fact limiting their upside by spreading the ball everywhere. Maybe its the system?? Which is why people tend not to know any of their names and why the Pats dont pay them anything. Maybe someone call help me with this but I checked Givens and Branch and neither has broken 1000 yards in their CAREERS.

OOoOO boy nevermind..looks like there was a one time 1000 yard receiver that Ive found..TROY BROWN! On 101 receptions he totaled 1199 yards..a pretty sad total for that many receptions (why am I surprised..they run slants all day long)

VERDICT:
Peyton is better.
<img src="http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9720/penningtonif2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" />
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