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Ot: Team Likely To Make Best Offer For Johan Santana since the jets suck, who gets the best pitcher in the game?

Poll: Team likely to make best offer to Santana (16 member(s) have cast votes)

Team likely to make best offer to Santana

  1. New York Yankees (6 votes [37.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 37.50%

  2. New York Mets (4 votes [25.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.00%

  3. Boston Red Sox (2 votes [12.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.50%

  4. Los Angeles Dodgers (3 votes [18.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 18.75%

  5. Minnesota Twins (stays) (1 votes [6.25%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.25%

Vote Edit icon Edit this poll

#41 User is offline   EnRiCH13 Icon

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 07:16 PM

PUBLIC DISCLAIMER:
JCBizkit87 is an ignorant poster.
If you are not with him on his arguments, please do not read or respond to his posts.
He will only respond with rash,tactless, and incoherent discourse.

Thank You.





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#42 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 07:50 PM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Nov 28 2007, 11:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Don't you think the numbers are skewed a little bit? Boston played the Yankees 18 times. They have the best hitters and Beckett had to pitch to them 4 times last year. That's gonna screw his stats up a tad.

Not only that but you guys are only telling half of the story when it comes to stats and anyway stats don't prove everything. Beckett is way more dominant. How about these numbers and I'm not sure what you're talking about but Beckett had a better ERA this year too.

2007 Stats
Beckett: ERA 3.27 | Hits 189 | Runs 76 | Home Runs 17 | Walks 40 | Strike Outs 194 | Wins 20
Santana: ERA 3.33 | Hits 183 | Runs 88 | Home Runs 33 | Walks 52 | Strike Outs 235 | Wins 15

So Santana has more strike outs, but they gave up practically the same amount of hits so that's all that matters. Santana has given up more runs and twice as many home runs. He also walked more people and was 5 back on wins. Johan pitched against the Yankees once last year. Beckett had to pitch to them 4 times. Not only that but both of those losses were only by 1 run. I'm not sure if you Tankees fans were even watching the playoffs since you got kicked out so soon but all they talked about was how Josh Beckett was the best pitcher in the game right now. Those are professionals that now more about the game than any of us do. I think that counts for something. Not only that but the guy is just absolutely dominant.

On a side note: I'm not sure why C.C. Sebathia won the Cy Young award because that's criminal. Beckett had more wins, fewer hits, fewer runs, fewer home runs, the same WHIP, and a slightly less ERA. Not only that but he dominated the hell out of Sebathia in the playoffs. Oh well. That's my argument. I know it's hard for Tankees fans to admit the truth, but the truth is that Beckett owns and you wish you had him.


Tell me, during Santana's few starts against the Yankees, the best hitting team in all of baseball, how has he done. Santana has completely dominated the Yankees his whole career. Can't say that about Josh Beckett, now can you? Infact I can only remember one start he did well against the Yankees in his career, and thats when he won the World Series for the Florida Marlins, since then he can't pitch against them. I can't remember the last time the Yankees ever hit Johan Santana well, or if they ever did.

Like I said, Josh Beckett may have had the better season, but that no way means he's the better pitcher, why don't you take each pitchers best season, and then see it that way. This has been Santana's worse season overall and if Santana 3.33 ERA is his worse season, and Beckett's 3.27 ERA is his best, whose the better pitcher?

Theres another huge difference. Santana plays for the Minnesota Twins, while Josh Beckett plays with the Boston Red Sox. I think the Red Sox have a hitting advantage, hence why Beckett had more wins the last season. You put him on a team like the Yankees, or Red Sox, and he'll probably almost win 25 games every single season.

There is no way Josh Beckett is anywhere near as good as pitchers like Johan Santana, Erik Bedard, or Scott Kazmir.
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#43 User is offline   JettingAwayAC Icon

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 07:58 PM

QUOTE (EnRiCH13 @ Nov 28 2007, 07:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
PUBLIC DISCLAIMER:
JCBizkit87 is an ignorant poster.
If you are not with him on his arguments, please do not read or respond to his posts.
He will only respond with rash,tactless, and incoherent discourse.

Thank You.

hysterical.gif
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#44 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 08:42 PM

I've deleated my last two posts that were regarding Enrich's posts, he's obviously not to bright enough to talk sports like a normal person, so instead of posting facts to prove his point, he just insults people.

I've been spending my time talking with Jetson about whose the better pitcher, yet you haven't seen me post such an idiotic statement like this enrich character did above. I'm having fun with this discussion with Jetson, but no Mets fan have given me facts, they just think they've got the better farm, which is total bullcrap.

When you Mets fans are smart enough to talk baseball, and your team is good enough to make it to the postseason, then talk to me, because until then, buzz off.
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#45 User is offline   EnRiCH13 Icon

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 09:07 PM

I indeed was not insulting..I was just warning others.
When a argument contradictory to yours arises, you immediately feel the need to insult them.
Also, when one tries to give you support to their claim you attack their support. I can understand difference of opinion, it happens all the time in discussions, but instead of making an intelligent counter to why someone else is wrong(and it seems with you, they are always wrong) you just go off and attack them in some way.
Don't get me wrong, some of your posts are promising, I see a strong argument, which may be right in some cases but you always feel the need to put down others in one post or another.
I just want to see less childish remarks and more solid argument because theres no need for it.

Thats is all for me because of the aforementioned.


GO METS!!!





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#46 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 09:18 PM

QUOTE (EnRiCH13 @ Nov 29 2007, 02:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I indeed was not insulting..I was just warning others.
When a argument contradictory to yours arises, you immediately feel the need to insult them.
Also, when one tries to give you support to their claim you attack their support. I can understand difference of opinion, it happens all the time in discussions, but instead of making an intelligent counter to why someone else is wrong(and it seems with you, they are always wrong) you just go off and attack them in some way.
Don't get me wrong, some of your posts are promising, I see a strong argument, which may be right in some cases but you always feel the need to put down others in one post or another.
I just want to see less childish remarks and more solid argument because theres no need for it.

Thats is all for me because of the aforementioned.
GO METS!!!


Actually, I insult people after I prove them wrong, and for you I understand that happens many, many times, and besides in what book does calling someone ignorant not an insult?
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#47 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 12:10 AM

Josh Beckett = Best pitcher in baseball. It's what have you done for me lately and Beckett did it all season long.
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#48 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 12:20 AM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Nov 29 2007, 05:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Josh Beckett = Best pitcher in baseball. It's what have you done for me lately and Beckett did it all season long.


Yeah, and that 0.06 ERA difference really is much. It's still his worse season, and im 99.9% sure that Johan Santana will end up having a better season then Beckett will next season.
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#49 User is offline   jets0n Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 12:27 AM

QUOTE (JCBizkit87 @ Nov 29 2007, 12:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yeah, and that 0.06 ERA difference really is much. It's still his worse season, and im 99.9% sure that Johan Santana will end up having a better season then Beckett will next season.


Well the good thing about being a Tankees fan is you can always dream.... hysterical.gif
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#50 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 12:31 AM

QUOTE (jets0n @ Nov 29 2007, 05:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well the good thing about being a Tankees fan is you can always dream.... hysterical.gif


How is it dreaming, it's very reasonable for someone like Johan Santana to have a better season then the highly overrated Josh Beckett. Who knows, knowing Beckett, he could get injured again, as usual. Thats another thing in Santana's advanatge. Beckett is injury prone. So, when Santana has a better season regardless of which team he's on, i'll be bumping this topic back up to point fingers and laugh at you, and if for some weird reason it goes in Beckett's advanatge, you could do the same.
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#51 User is offline   Holmes10 Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 04:31 AM

I get a kick out of MLB arguments! Their system sucks! Let me see some sort of a cap come about and I'll be impressed. The same 6 or so teams every year throwing ridiculous money at the top free agents! Like I've stated before only a sport like baseball could have a team pay one (1) player,Clemons more then the entire Devil Ray team! I'm sorry, I just don't see the fun anymore in that sport! But , hey enjoy guys! And I'm aware that Santana isn't a free agent. I love the contracts that the superstars sign, where there is only a handful of teams that they will accept a trade to, and the Devil Rays, Royals, Twins, Marlins etc. are never in those handful!



And since this a JET FOOTBALL FORUM, I wanted to add my two cents regarding baseball topics!
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#52 User is offline   ganggreen_ewok Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 03:47 PM

QUOTE (EnRiCH13 @ Nov 28 2007, 06:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
PUBLIC DISCLAIMER:
JCBizkit87 is an ignorant poster.
If you are not with him on his arguments, please do not read or respond to his posts.
He will only respond with rash,tactless, and incoherent discourse.

Thank You.

POST OF THE MUTHAFVCKIN YEAR CHEA!

QUOTE (EnRiCH13 @ Nov 28 2007, 08:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I indeed was not insulting..I was just warning others.
When a argument contradictory to yours arises, you immediately feel the need to insult them.
Also, when one tries to give you support to their claim you attack their support. I can understand difference of opinion, it happens all the time in discussions, but instead of making an intelligent counter to why someone else is wrong(and it seems with you, they are always wrong) you just go off and attack them in some way.
Don't get me wrong, some of your posts are promising, I see a strong argument, which may be right in some cases but you always feel the need to put down others in one post or another.
I just want to see less childish remarks and more solid argument because theres no need for it.

Thats is all for me because of the aforementioned.
GO METS!!!

If it's not Pro-Yankees then your obviously wrong DUH doesn't everyone know that!?

View Postganggreen_ewok, on 13 June 2011 - 07:43 PM, said:

"And once again, the meow became a roar"


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#53 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 04:33 PM

And this is the hilarious part, just because these Mets fans can't take it that their farm just sucks, and they don't prove themselves otherwise, they go ahead and ruin a topic by insulting the person whose bashing their farm.

Listen, Mets fans, I'm sorry that your teams farm system sucks, and has nothing against players like Hughes, Chamberlain, Kennedy, and Tabata. I'm sorry that you're stuck with players like Pelfrey, and Humber for your pitching prospects. I'm sorry that your team couldn't even make the playoffs with the third highest payroll in the game. I'm sorry that your team is the joke of the state of New York. I'm sorry that Yankee fans think your team is a waste, and would rather the dodgers would have stayed here, because they were at least good.

I know it's hard to ask, but why not keep the topic actually on topic. Ya know what, after this post, i'm just going to ignore what Enrich, and Ewok have to say, because they're obviously too ignorant to talk baseball, and whose getting the best pitcher in the game. Only Mets fans with actually knowledge of the game are Dave, and Ron. There is probably more, but i'm sorry if I missed you, I got stuck with these two idiots in my head.
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#54 User is offline   Jetsfan0099 Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 04:41 PM

I dont have a problem with what he is saying, he is right on on most things. The Mets dont have a better farm system, its known in the whole friggen league, and your going to say that its just because we are Yankees fans. Unbelievable!!
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#55 User is offline   Jetsfan0099 Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 04:43 PM

QUOTE (JCBizkit87 @ Nov 29 2007, 05:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And this is the hilarious part, just because these Mets fans can't take it that their farm just sucks, and they don't prove themselves otherwise, they go ahead and ruin a topic by insulting the person whose bashing their farm.

Listen, Mets fans, I'm sorry that your teams farm system sucks, and has nothing against players like Hughes, Chamberlain, Kennedy, and Tabata. I'm sorry that you're stuck with players like Pelfrey, and Humber for your pitching prospects. I'm sorry that your team couldn't even make the playoffs with the third highest payroll in the game. I'm sorry that your team is the joke of the state of New York. I'm sorry that Yankee fans think your team is a waste, and would rather the dodgers would have stayed here, because they were at least good.

I know it's hard to ask, but why not keep the topic actually on topic. Ya know what, after this post, i'm just going to ignore what Enrich, and Ewok have to say, because they're obviously too ignorant to talk baseball, and whose getting the best pitcher in the game. Only Mets fans with actually knowledge of the game are Dave, and Ron. There is probably more, but i'm sorry if I missed you, I got stuck with these two idiots in my head.

There are more, and they admit that their farm system isnt as strong as the yankees right now.
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#56 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 04:48 PM

QUOTE (Jetsfan0099 @ Nov 29 2007, 09:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I dont have a problem with what he is saying, he is right on on most things. The Mets dont have a better farm system, its known in the whole friggen league, and your going to say that its just because we are Yankees fans. Unbelievable!!


Yeah, they keep saying that since they don't believe with what i'm saying I end up going ahead and insulting them, which I don't recall really doing in this topic, I mean look at the discussion i've been having with Jetson, have you really seen me insult the guy? No, we're just talking who we both think is better between the two pitchers.

Then you've got the Mets fans, sure i've insulted them, but thats because they insulted me before I did. Would I have insulted them before they insulted me, no, because it isin't worth it, and they'll eventually find that out when they grow up. These are Mets fans though, you got to understand that their team puts them through pretty much hell. You see Enrich, and Ewok, the last time they won was in 1986... They were not even born yet... so, you see it sucks to be them...
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#57 User is offline   Jetsfan0099 Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 05:03 PM

Red Sox talking a deal... Lester, Crisp, Lowrie for Santana, I think the Red Sox have the better end, If I was the twins I would demand Ellisbury, Buchhotlz. http://sports.espn.g...tory?id=3133598
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#58 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 05:07 PM

QUOTE (Jetsfan0099 @ Nov 29 2007, 10:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Red Sox talking a deal... Lester, Crisp, Lowrie for Santana, I think the Red Sox have the better end, If I was the twins I would demand Ellisbury, Buchhotlz. http://sports.espn.g...tory?id=3133598


Yeah, in my opinion that offer is to just get the yankees to offer up Phil Hughes, which we still shouldn't do. Consdiering that Ian Kennedy, has way more upside then Lester does, and Melky is like 23, so he still has a chance to get really good, even though to this day he is better than Crispies, and then you got Jed Lowrie, all we've got to basically do is add someone like Austin Jackson or Jose Tabata.

So tell me, how is Lester, Crisp, and Lowrie different from Kennedy, Melky, and Tabata. If you ask me they're just bluffing to get us to send more, and we better not trade Hughes, because Hughes is the real deal, he'll be as good as someone like Kazmir, or Bedard.
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#59 User is offline   Jetsfan0099 Icon

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 05:29 PM

If the twins do that they are stupid, thats a horrible deal. Crisp sucks, Lester is decent but Crisp sucks so that brings the value down.
That would be scary if the Sox get Santana, having him and Beckett. WOW THey would defintely win the WS again.
But I dont want the Yankees to let Hughes, or Cano go. Hughes is a definte stud young pitcher, I really see him being a ace. Cano is a rising star, no way we trade him. I would let Kennedy go, even though I like him also, I think he can be a really good pitcher. But out of Chamberlin, Hughes and Kennedy, I have Kenndy the worst out of them. I think Hughes is the best, then Chamberlin, I still dont think Joba is a better starter than Hughes yet as a prospect just because he hasnt been a starter yet in the MLB, he was just a RP. I really like Melky, he gives us energy, its hard to let him go but to get a pitcher like Santana, that would have to happen. I like the idea of giving Kennedy and Melky with another guy for Santana, keep Hughes off the list, he is too good and young to let go. A 21 year old possible future ace. Melky is a better player than Crisp, Melkys a better hitter and is only 23 where Crisp is 28.
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#60 Guest_JCBizkit87_*

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Posted 30 November 2007 - 01:29 AM

Seems like both the Yankees, and Red Sox are too smart for the Twins' mind games. They want the Red Sox to add Ellsbury, and the Sox won't budge, and they want the Yankees to add Hughes, and they wont budge either.

The Yankees current offer is believed to be Ian Kennedy, Melky Cabrera, and either Alan Horne, or Jose Tabata. It doesn't seem like either the Yankees or Red Sox will be adding Hughes, or Ellsbury, so it'll be the Twins' choice to either send Santana to either of these teams for what they've offered, or look elsewhere, like the Mets, Angels, or Dodgers.
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