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Brian Schottenheimer The Weakest Link?

#1 User is offline   S-Dubb Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 11:39 AM


Quote

Where I Consider My Hurtful Remarks About Brian Schottenheimer
By Andrew Weiss on 14. Sep, 2010

Some of you wrote that I was a little-er-strong in my criticism of Brian Schottenheimer last night. In the cold light of day, let's think about it. In the NFL, the only thing you have to show for your work is performance. Everything else is just speculation. So let's look at the actual performance of our esteemed Offensive Coordinator. Let's look at the body of work.

Naturally, we're only interested in BS in his present position. At San Diego, where he is given credit for rearing Drew Brees and Philip Rivers, he was working with another man's system. He was only the QB coach. So, how those QBs performed is only relevant to the systems they were executing. Brian doesn't get credit for Rivers and Brees because Matt Cavanaugh, the Jets QB coach, shouldn't be blamed for last night.

So let's look at Brian Schottenheimer's system, his body of work as an Offensive Coordinator. His first crack was his present job, with the New York Jets, which he got in 2006.

Sean Sheppard has written a piece this morning on Brian Schottenheimer's career performance as OC on a game-by-game basis. His conclusion? "Brian Schottenheimer Led Offenses: Not One 300 Yard Passer Since 2006!" That's right, according to Sean, the Jets have not had a 300-yard passer since 2006, and that's under two different coaches with two different philosophies. Not only that, two of his quarterbacks were proven winners who both went on to produce 300-yard games after they left the Jets. It's a great piece and I recommend that you read it (here).

Sean didn't go into Schotty's season standings. How have his offenses done since he became an offensive coordinator?

The overall ranking (total yards) for Brian Schottenheimer' offenses in the past four years (2006 – 2009) is 25, 26, 16, 20. That's never higher than sixteenth in a league of 32 teams. In case you're wondering, the 16 was the year that Favre was here and the offense had to be "simplified" for the Mississippi mauler, who was accused of being unwilling to study hard. So, on average, BS offenses (Jets' offenses) have ranked 22nd in a 32-team league. As for passing, Brian Schottenheimer's specialty, the rankings were 17, 25, 16 and 31—sixteenth with Favre, 31st with the rookie, Sanchez. The average? 22nd in a 32-team league. Consistent, if nothing else. As for rushing, there's been continual improvement from 20th in 2006, when he took over, to first, last year, an average of 12th. Well, at least he can do that.

What about mentoring and guiding quarterbacks? When Schotty took over in 2006, his quarterback was Chad Pennington returning from injury. Chad's 2006 season was a respectable twelfth. Not bad, huh? Except Chad had never ranked lower than eleventh in his career which included a number one ranking in 2002. The following year under Schottenheimer, 2007, Chad ranked an inexplicable 15th. The team decided he was fragile and probably done, so they let him go and brought in Favre, who promptly ranked 21st among quarterbacks in Schottenheimer's simplified scheme. Just a couple of washed-up veterans, right? Except, Chad Pennington would rank second with Miami's poor receiving corps, once he left the Jets in 2008, and Brett Favre, would rank second in 2009, when he went to Minnesota. Sanchez, who showed so much promise in the first few games of the '09 season, wound up 28th. For those of you who like trends, since Brian Schottenheimer got here five years ago, his quarterbacks have ranked 12, 15, 21 and 28, and after yesterday's performance, 31st. We appear to be on a trend that will set a record, ranking 33rd out of a possible 32 teams.

So it doesn't look promising. It is axiomatic that the best predictor of future performance is past performance. If that's the case, the Super bowl is off the table. The Ravens, who had no offense to speak of, yet who won the Super Bowl in 2000, were ranked sixteenth in the league in total offense that year. The Jets have only sniffed that lofty ranking once under Schottenheimer, and that was with a Hall of Famer at QB.

So get used to it. If you want to go to the Super Bowl, Rex or Tanny or somebody over in Florham Park will have to face facts. The numbers don't lie.

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#2 User is offline   RaisedOnRiots Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 11:55 AM

Um, no problems on this end last night, boys.


Heh.
"And He Leadeth Them, To Suckage"...
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 12:02 PM

wow interesting read, maybe schotty is worse then we think?
Get it done MT
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 12:14 PM

He's inconsistent, and that's his problem to me.
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 12:49 PM

View PostJetsman05, on 14 September 2010 - 12:14 PM, said:

He's inconsistent, and that's his problem to me.


He was terrible for the first part of last season and rebounded to a good second half and was decent in the playoffs. The running game was both dynamic and diverse in the second half of the season. Before that, look at the Buffalo game in particular, it was obvious he was trying to be the smartest guy on the field. It was the same thing as Martz. You don't win games by being fancy, you win them by playing to your strengths and to the opponent's weaknesses.

I think some blame has to be put on Ryan though. Last night we expected our secondary to be lockdown and the Jets to challenge theirs. It was reversed. Cromartie and (especially) Wilson were exposed, while we went downfield so rarely the cameraman must have been thinking, "woo, easy night." No panning at all, just aim at the center because about three Jet plays got more than five yards past the line of scrimmage.
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Exterminate all rational thought, that is the conclusion I have come to
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#6 User is offline   cat50 Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 01:19 PM

View PostJetsman05, on 14 September 2010 - 01:14 PM, said:

He's inconsistent, and that's his problem to me.


Good article...I want him gone asap

His inability or refusal to challenge their weakness lost the game
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 01:20 PM

View PostRaisedOnRiots, on 14 September 2010 - 09:55 AM, said:

Um, no problems on this end last night, boys.


Heh.



Your offense looked dam good. Charles is a beast, i don't know why they didn't get him the ball more
Get it done MT
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 01:25 PM

His dad had a tag for his offensive system:

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Marty_Ball

We need to come up with tag for Brian's scheme. Marty at least had a idea of what he wanted to do!
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#9 User is offline   RaisedOnRiots Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 01:29 PM

View PostJetsfan115, on 14 September 2010 - 01:20 PM, said:

Your offense looked dam good. Charles is a beast, i don't know why they didn't get him the ball more


Yeah, I think they're trying to use him effectively and not just run him in to the ground.

I was sitting right in the corner of the end zone when he ran that in. When DMC scored on the kickoff, the place went batshit. I was sitting next to two little old ladies who were just pounding the piss out of their seats and screaming their heads off the whole game. Almost everyone was on their feet the whole game, and only a handful of people pussed out because of the rain.
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 01:35 PM

Got to fire Schotty, this guy is a bum and could destroy the development of Sanchez. Sanchez turned into captain checkdown last night, IDK what happened, he wasn't this afraid to throw last year... Yeah you can't turn it over, but being a QB in this league you also have to make plays... I don't want to say too much though because I don't have the coaches film and can't see what type of coverages they had. Ray Lewis said that they planned to take away Edwards last night with double teams, but still I saw Edwards open 2 times for a TD.
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#11 User is offline   Jetsman05 Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 01:36 PM

Great, KC fans are calling Dex DMC now? He wasn't called it through college, now we have 3 DMC's!! (McFadden and McNabb)

It looked a great atmosphere at the new arrowhead, though.

Can't root for them though, wayyyy too many Patriots involved in that team.
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#12 User is offline   RaisedOnRiots Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 02:04 PM

View PostJetsman05, on 14 September 2010 - 01:36 PM, said:

Great, KC fans are calling Dex DMC now? He wasn't called it through college, now we have 3 DMC's!! (McFadden and McNabb)

It looked a great atmosphere at the new arrowhead, though.

Can't root for them though, wayyyy too many Patriots involved in that team.


Eh, they'll thin out soon enough.
"And He Leadeth Them, To Suckage"...
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#13 User is offline   wichitacommish Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 02:06 PM

View PostJetsman05, on 14 September 2010 - 12:14 PM, said:

He's inconsistent, and that's his problem to me.


Well he consistently ran the ball on EVERY first down, could we mix in a first down pass? Sorry lost my head, THAT would be WAY too radical a concept.
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#14 User is offline   Jetsman05 Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 02:28 PM

View PostRaisedOnRiots, on 14 September 2010 - 03:04 PM, said:

Eh, they'll thin out soon enough.


Not the way Romeo and Fat boy coached last night, they'll be there for awhile.
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 02:38 PM

I was actually going to make a thread about how I am officially done with Schotty, but this thread more than does the job. The article posts a better picture of why Schotty needs to go than I could have written up in angry tirade.

The saddest part is, the only thing thats improved greatly is the rushing attack, which Bill Callahan created. It was reported that Schotty just let Callahan draw up all the run plays and he just focused on the passing game. So the guy only focuses on one aspect of the game, and cant make it to the top half of the league once? comon now.

Schotty always babies his qbs, even Favre! I'm starting to think its propagande leaked by him or someone close to him to make up for the fact that he really doesnt have anything special in the pass game. I mean what is he waiting for? Run, Run, pass punt is not a great strategy. Almost every series is like this.

On top of that, he doesnt know how to manage his personnel. LT comes in and has a big 12-13 yard run, then a 6 yard run, so what to does Schotty do? take him out. So u put in Greene you think hes gunna pound the ball but no, he goes shotgun and Greene drops an easy swing pass that could have picked up a first or at least made it 3rd and short. So he took LT out for Greene to be in on a shotgun pass play, not playing to Greene's skills, just to put LT back in the very next play and get stuffed on 3rd and four because he runs a strung out run, when LT was getting yards up the middle.

I just cant stand to watch the offense anymore. I mean i know we are a run team but not 74 passing yards? really? an NFL team and you cant break 100 passing yards when there aren't even any harsh weather conditions? you got to be kidding me. thats flat out unacceptable.

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#16 User is offline   RaisedOnRiots Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 02:39 PM

View PostJetsman05, on 14 September 2010 - 02:28 PM, said:

Not the way Romeo and Fat boy coached last night, they'll be there for awhile.


Oh, I thought you meant players.

Oh yeah, I'm not letting those two leave town ever!
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#17 User is offline   S. Newsum Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 04:14 PM

Excellent comment! When he took out LT to then throw a flare pass to Greene on the very next play...at that point I knew he had just lost his mind. He needs to go now.


View PostClemens11, on 14 September 2010 - 02:38 PM, said:

I was actually going to make a thread about how I am officially done with Schotty, but this thread more than does the job. The article posts a better picture of why Schotty needs to go than I could have written up in angry tirade.

The saddest part is, the only thing thats improved greatly is the rushing attack, which Bill Callahan created. It was reported that Schotty just let Callahan draw up all the run plays and he just focused on the passing game. So the guy only focuses on one aspect of the game, and cant make it to the top half of the league once? comon now.

Schotty always babies his qbs, even Favre! I'm starting to think its propagande leaked by him or someone close to him to make up for the fact that he really doesnt have anything special in the pass game. I mean what is he waiting for? Run, Run, pass punt is not a great strategy. Almost every series is like this.

On top of that, he doesnt know how to manage his personnel. LT comes in and has a big 12-13 yard run, then a 6 yard run, so what to does Schotty do? take him out. So u put in Greene you think hes gunna pound the ball but no, he goes shotgun and Greene drops an easy swing pass that could have picked up a first or at least made it 3rd and short. So he took LT out for Greene to be in on a shotgun pass play, not playing to Greene's skills, just to put LT back in the very next play and get stuffed on 3rd and four because he runs a strung out run, when LT was getting yards up the middle.

I just cant stand to watch the offense anymore. I mean i know we are a run team but not 74 passing yards? really? an NFL team and you cant break 100 passing yards when there aren't even any harsh weather conditions? you got to be kidding me. thats flat out unacceptable.

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#18 User is offline   HurricaneJet32 Icon

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 04:17 PM

The biggest problem, in my mind, with SChotty is his sequencing.

He is so obscenely predictable. Playcalling isn't a one play at a time art...it's a sequence. He doesn't do a good job of calling plays in a good order and rhythm to keep the defense off balance and your offense on balance.

Scenario 1:

- First play of the drive he gets a 7 yard pass...2nd and 3.
- 2nd play incomplete idiot pass to LT.
- 3rd play deep bomb incomplete to Cotchery.

That shit works if you're offense has been clicking and you can make up for missing a 3rd down conversion. But, the Jets offense had been pathetic and desperately needed a first down. They couldn't afford to take a shot at catching the secondary off guard with a deep pass.

Result: Another 3 and Out.

Scenario 2:

- First play of the drive, LT left 5 yards.
- LT left 3 yards.
- LT right - 1 yards.
- Punt

I think this one speaks for itself.
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 04:35 PM

Well lets look at this logically.

It is so easy to blame the oc when anything goes wrong with the offense but none of you are using your heads and looking at what we had on the team.

In 06 and 07 we had Pennington who had two major shoulder surgeries along with an already weak arm. Not to mention fans bitched about every oc we had when Chad was qb and it took years for most fans to finally realize it was Chad`s weak arm.As weak as Chads arm was he still threw downfield with Schotty at oc.Even Chad ran a better two minute offense than Sanchez did with a much better line.

Chad went to Miami in 08 with a strong offensive line and did well since he only had to manage the game with a good running team

Not sure about 06 but in 07 the Jets had a weak offensive line that didnt help matters much. The offensive line just started coming together in mid 08

In 08 we got Favre late and he was getting hit alot but to his credit he did pull some plays out of his ass.He also ended up with that shoulder injury.Favre threw downfield with Schotty as oc.

09 we got Sanchez and he was airing it out in the beginning and having tournovers left and right. The offense was simplified and Sanchez did better with just managing the game since we had a strong line and good running game.

first game of 2010 whether he was told just to manage the game and rely on the run or whether Sanchez is just unable to make big plays is the issue.


Basically what Im saying is using common sense you cant blame this all on Schotty. That is downright stupid. He may be part to blame but no way all of it.There have been to many other factors in play. It isnt a simple black and white answer.This is a complex game with many keys.

Sanchez was at the line changing plays on his own. When they cut Sanchez loose he screwed up. Maybe he had the chains on and maybe he didnt. Either way I have no confidence at all in Sanchez. Maybe he is young and needs more time who knows. You guys acted like he was the second coming and I have yet to see it. So far he is a bust in my eyes. If all he can do is manage a game he is a bust period. Any college qb can come into the NFL and throw check downs.I just think Sanchez cant deal with the game speed. If you look at him he isnt scanning the whole field before he throws. Whether that is bad coaching or whether he thinks to slow is the issue.Either way he is the only qb weve had that isnt throwing downfield. Clemens has thrown downfield when he has been in.

Using even more common sense if it was always the oc then why the hell can some teams bring in a back up qb that surprises everyone and suddenly the offense gells like it never did with the starting qb.
Maybe Schotty is partly to blame but this is mainly Sanchez period.He isnt a f***ing robot. He is the one throwing the ball.You guys have blinders on and only see part of the picture.

Its only Sanchez`s second year but so far he isnt proving a thing to me. Who knows Sanchez could very well be another Matt Leinart. Leinart was another qb that was expected to do big things and failed miserably.

And yes second year qb`s can do good if they actually are good. Roethlisberger SuperBowl 2nd year, Eli Manning Playoffs 2nd year,Flacco playoffs 1st, 2nd, Rivers playoffs 1st,2nd year starting(though he was two years as a backup), Carlson Palmer playoffs 2nd year, Tom Brady 1st year starting playoffs(second year in league, Peyton Manning 2nd year playoffs, Drew Bledsoe playoffs 2nd year, Donovan Mcnabb 2nd year.



This team is built to win a Superbowl and if we fail to make the playoffs at least then it is basically proved in my eyes that Sanchez sucks and is a bust. There are to many good qbs I listed with teams that were no where near as good as the Jets are and their 2nd year qbs succeeded
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Posted 14 September 2010 - 04:47 PM

Ravens defense controlled the line . next game . will the pats defense be so effective ?
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