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Qb Dept. : Eli Vs. Mark - " Eli Will 'outduel' Mark " .... :(

#1 User is offline   kelly Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 12:07 PM

Giants have QB to bail them out

The Giants and Jets both suffered hurtful losses against losing teams prior to their Christmas Eve battle this week. Although each team lost playoff footing, the Giants' loss was more damaging. The Jets were focused in on a wild-card berth with the Patriots in the driver's seat for the AFC East, but the Giants still were in prime position to lock up the NFC East and, hence, earn a home playoff game. That's why their loss to the last-place Redskins was the more damaging.

Still, the Giants are in a better position to win this game against the Jets and the Week 17 contest against the Cowboys, which would get them into the postseason dance. Why? Eli Manning.

The PFW Spin

It's perhaps a bit odd that we are trumpeting Manning coming off his worst game of the season, but his poor game against the Redskins fits his profile to a tee. Once or twice a season, Manning just seems to have one of those games where nothing works. He clearly was trying to bail out his ineffective defense, which was on the field all game, and made critical throws that cost his team possessions and points.

But the good news is that Manning tends to follow his clunkers with his best performances, especially late in the season. In 2007, Manning followed up a four-turnover game at Buffalo with a four-TD game against the 15-0 Patriots and followed it up with the team's magical playoff run and a Super Bowl MVP award. Witness 2008 when he came back from a two-pick, two-fumble loss at Dallas to engineer a solid, mistake-free win over the Panthers in a battle for the NFC's No. 1 seed that season. In '09, Manning bounced back from a bad performance at Denver to go on a three-game tear. And last season, he put aside the memory of a four-turnover game against the Eagles to put up his best passer rating of the season vs. the Jaguars, who came in dangerous at 6-4.

Manning has the memory of a Hall of Fame relief pitcher or a great cornerback. He seldom allows one bad game to affect the next contest. That's why bottom-line Tom Coughlin loves Manning so much. And the coach's theme this week will be to put the memory of Sunday's loss in the history books. In a short week, it will be on Manning and Coughlin to put aside the distractions and remember that the Giants control their own fate for a playoff bid. Losses, whether by one point or 32 points, still count the same.

The good news is that Jets head coach Rex Ryan already has started with the pregame hype, which only can take the pressure off the Giants. Ryan said Monday of the Giants, "I realize they are an excellent football team, but I think we are better." Coughlin secretly loves that. He can sit back, praise the Jets and let them talk up the game while the Giants come in as the so-called underdog. Manning will love it, too. He will praise the Jets' defense up and down all week, but on Sunday he has the cold nerves to tear them up.

:vava: The Jets' defense is a shell of its once-great self :vava: . The pass rush is spotty at best, the secondary has one great player, the linebackers don't have great edge speed. Really, it's a well-coached unit, but one that is lacking in superior talent. The Giants certainly have the weapons to do some damage. Jets OLB Calvin Pace admitted after the game that had the Eagles not called off the dogs, they could have scored more. That's really bad to admit, and the 45 points Philly laid down were bad enough.

But the biggest advantage is at quarterback :nea: . Manning simply is far better and more reliable than Mark Sanchez. Manning might not be perfect, but he's far less flawed than his crosstown counterpart and is in the midst of his finest season to date. Victor Cruz is a stalwart, and Hakeem Nicks might not have as bad a game as he did Sunday for another three years, maybe not ever.

Manning and the Giants will go on the road in their home stadium and earn a win.



He will outduel :OMG: Sanchez and the Giants will be a game away from winning the NFC East.

> http://www.profootba...o-bail-them-out
i ♥ u guys ..hey !..HEY ! ! ! you can come up now...
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#2 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 01:53 PM

that was a horrible and 1 sided read. jets are what 6th in defense and were a shell of our former self? giants will win cause eli bounces back after a bad game? really? how many defenses has he played that are top 10? how about they mention the giants are like 29th in defense and can't stop a nose bleed, how about mention that their once great run game is now like 30th in the league. they don't even have a 600 yard rusher and there is only 2 games left and both their top RBs average less then 4YPC.
Get it done MT
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#3 User is offline   ROBJETS Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 03:30 PM

View PostJetsfan115, on 20 December 2011 - 01:53 PM, said:

that was a horrible and 1 sided read. jets are what 6th in defense and were a shell of our former self? giants will win cause eli bounces back after a bad game? really? how many defenses has he played that are top 10? how about they mention the giants are like 29th in defense and can't stop a nose bleed, how about mention that their once great run game is now like 30th in the league. they don't even have a 600 yard rusher and there is only 2 games left and both their top RBs average less then 4YPC.

Not disagreeing with any thing you are saying. Obviously you did some homework on your post. That said I don't feel the Jets really have a top ten defense regardless of where they rank on paper.

The defensive rank is basically padded from the blowouts against the really bad teams. Any team that has any kind of solid offense has scored pretty easy on this team. Just like last week.
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#4 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:25 PM

View PostROBJETS, on 20 December 2011 - 12:30 PM, said:

Not disagreeing with any thing you are saying. Obviously you did some homework on your post. That said I don't feel the Jets really have a top ten defense regardless of where they rank on paper.

The defensive rank is basically padded from the blowouts against the really bad teams. Any team that has any kind of solid offense has scored pretty easy on this team. Just like last week.


all defenses this year aren't performing as good as previous years. i'm not sure why. new rules? stricter penalties? lockout? couldn't really tell you. but 4 Qbs are on pace for 5000 yard seasons. crazy huh? and even balt got lit up by SD. it happens, but overall our defense is way better then the giants. only thing they do better then us is pass and i think with out DBs we match up well
Get it done MT
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#5 User is offline   azjetfan Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:51 PM

I have said before and will say again.... Stats don't tell the story. You cannot use stats to compare teams when they have not played the same opponents under the same circumstances and conditions. However they are fun to talk, brag and have conversations about. I think ROB has a very valid point. We have given up a lot of points in games.

Oakland 34
Baltimore 34
New England 30
New England 37
Philly 45

I do realize not all of those points are from the D. Some are turnovers ECT... The fact is Statistically we may show lower yardage, More turnovers ECT... but our D has not been a top 10 D
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#6 User is offline   A1elbow Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:54 PM

I don't bother reading articles that are about how Manning is elite despite games where he throws five interceptions (especially when the argument is he does it "twice a year, but!...").

Manning is an okay QB who has more apologists than virtually any other professional athlete; Sanchez is an okay QB who has more detractors than virtually any other professional athlete.
--
Oh, and our defense continues to massively underperform this year.
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Exterminate all rational thought, that is the conclusion I have come to
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#7 User is offline   azjetfan Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:55 PM

View PostJetsfan115, on 20 December 2011 - 03:25 PM, said:

i think with out DBs we match up well


I agree 100%. If we dont turn the ball over and help Hunter we win this one. I believe their TE is out so we dont have that to worry about. Or do we.....
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#8 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 05:00 PM

View Postazjetfan, on 20 December 2011 - 01:51 PM, said:

I have said before and will say again.... Stats don't tell the story. You cannot use stats to compare teams when they have not played the same opponents under the same circumstances and conditions. However they are fun to talk, brag and have conversations about. I think ROB has a very valid point. We have given up a lot of points in games.

Oakland 34
Baltimore 34
New England 30
New England 37
Philly 45

I do realize not all of those points are from the D. Some are turnovers ECT... The fact is Statistically we may show lower yardage, More turnovers ECT... but our D has not been a top 10 D


FYI we lead the NFL in points allowed off turnovers and special teams turnovers. those are not good stats.
Get it done MT
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#9 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 05:09 PM

View PostA1elbow, on 20 December 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:

I don't bother reading articles that are about how Manning is elite despite games where he throws five interceptions (especially when the argument is he does it "twice a year, but!...").

Manning is an okay QB who has more apologists than virtually any other professional athlete; Sanchez is an okay QB who has more detractors than virtually any other professional athlete.
--
Oh, and our defense continues to massively underperform this year.


Exactly. Eli is who he is. He is an average QB who can throw alot of TDs but also alot of INTs. he's always been an INT machine. People kill mark for throwing 17 INTs his rookie year yet eli in his 8th year threw 25 and led the NFL in INTs just last year. eli averages over 17INTs a seasons for his career. Its not to say he doens't look good some times but he's a known stat whore. he'll pad stats all day. He isn't in the elite calls of rodgers, brady, brees, peyton, etc. I'd say he's not even 2nd class like ben, rivers, schuab etc
Get it done MT
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#10 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 05:14 PM

not syaing Qb rating is the best way to rate a QB but if you look at his career rating (8 years) and compare it to other modern day QBs with a similar amount of experience he falls behind

palmer
flacco
mcnabb
gerrard
brunell
cassell
hasselbeck

and in front of

leftwhich
orten
kitna
smith


active Qbs career rating leaders are
rodgers
romo
brady
rivers
peyton manning
brees
roethlisberger
schuab
ryan
palmer
flacco
cutler
cassell
hasselbeck
eli

he's not even top 10 career rating out of current starting QBs. the first 6-7 are the true elite Qbs
Get it done MT
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#11 User is offline   azjetfan Icon

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 05:16 PM

View PostJetsfan115, on 20 December 2011 - 04:00 PM, said:

FYI we lead the NFL in points allowed off turnovers and special teams turnovers. those are not good stats.

Agreed
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#12 User is offline   SokeSleezy Icon

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 01:41 PM

in a way,i really hope Sanchez lights up the Giants score wise...i cant stand how the giants lose games then Eli makes one miracle come back for a win and all of a sudden he's the fuckin man when Sanchez pulled that shit 3 weeks in a row! let Sanchez do his thing for once and dont hold him back,dont even think bout the Playoffs bein on the line this week,NY is on the line!
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#13 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 04:36 PM

View PostSokeSleezy, on 21 December 2011 - 10:41 AM, said:

in a way,i really hope Sanchez lights up the Giants score wise...i cant stand how the giants lose games then Eli makes one miracle come back for a win and all of a sudden he's the fuckin man when Sanchez pulled that shit 3 weeks in a row! let Sanchez do his thing for once and dont hold him back,dont even think bout the Playoffs bein on the line this week,NY is on the line!


sanchez pulled that off 3 years in a row lol. he had 6 4th quarter comebacks in his 2nd season. eli only reached 6 once before in 8 years before this season.
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#14 User is offline   ROBJETS Icon

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 06:40 PM

View PostJetsfan115, on 21 December 2011 - 04:36 PM, said:

sanchez pulled that off 3 years in a row lol. he had 6 4th quarter comebacks in his 2nd season. eli only reached 6 once before in 8 years before this season.

Yeah well that's a bullshit comparison answer if I ever heard one. Mark was below average the two seasons. If Mark wouldn't have struggled almost every game in the first half he wouldn't have had to have had so many comebacks.
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Posted 21 December 2011 - 07:43 PM

View PostROBJETS, on 21 December 2011 - 03:40 PM, said:

Yeah well that's a bullshit comparison answer if I ever heard one. Mark was below average the two seasons. If Mark wouldn't have struggled almost every game in the first half he wouldn't have had to have had so many comebacks.


same can be said for eli. in his 1st 2.5 years of starting (3 seasons) he threw 44 picks you don't think that caused them to be behind alot? plus last year he led the NFL in INTs you don't think that puts him behind?
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#16 User is offline   kelly Icon

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Posted 28 December 2011 - 04:24 AM

oh well ....
:zz:
i ♥ u guys ..hey !..HEY ! ! ! you can come up now...
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#17 User is offline   Jetsfan115 Icon

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Posted 28 December 2011 - 10:25 AM

View Postkelly, on 28 December 2011 - 01:24 AM, said:

oh well ....
:zz:


he completed 9 passes and none of them traveled more then 11 yards in the air sooo.... i'm pretty sure he wasn't out dueled
Get it done MT
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