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Members Of Congress Urge Redskins To Change Name

#61 User is offline   Mr_Jet Icon

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 10:52 PM

View PostSecondHandJets, on 29 May 2013 - 09:46 PM, said:

I skimmed through this giant block of shit that you wrote and here's what I think: it took a strong black person in every sport to stand up to the injustice of the time. Right? Even before the Jackie Robinsons and the Chuck Coopers, there was a movement within the sport and within the sport communities that let you know, even a decade ahead of time, that this is not right. Change is coming. How come none of this happens with the Redskins? The Redskins have been around for more than 80 years. In that time span, there have been dozens of Native American players and hundreds of polynesians in the league. How many complained? How many refused to be part of the Redskins because they were offended? There are hundreds more playing DI football, how many have gone on record saying that they wouldn't play for the Redskins? NONE. You know why? Cause it's not the same thing as having a team called the New York Ni99ers. You know how I know? Because if the Jets changed their name to the Ni99ers, no sane black athlete would play for that team and a few would probably try to kill Woody! Would Cam Newton play for the Carolina Coons? How about Russell Wilson getting drafted by the Seattle Porch Monkeys? NO NO and NO!!!! This lobbying efforts by a handful of Congressmen would have you believe that the Redskins are causing a bot of harm to the communities that they represent, but they don't. Polamalu is from American Samoa. He doesn't cut his goddamn dirty hair because it pay an "homage to his ancestry"... but not once did he say that the term "Redskins" is offensive nor did he ever sit out a game against them. That's my barometer for whether this is right or wrong. Not some politician trying to get his name into the papers.

Yes I group all special interests with lobbying power together. I don't care whether they're Native Americans, farmers, oil etc etc it's all detrimental to our nation. Unfortunately, no one cares enough to change how things work so we'll forever be doing the bidding of the guy that's got enough on the line to pay someone to bang their drum for him.


Oh God, that's more then three lines. All that text is too difficult for me. :rolleyes:

I'll just pick out certain things out of all your nonsense.

Quote

it took a strong black person in every sport to stand up to the injustice of the time. Right? Even before the Jackie Robinsons and the Chuck Coopers, there was a movement within the sport and within the sport communities that let you know, even a decade ahead of time, that this is not right. Change is coming. How come none of this happens with the Redskins? The Redskins have been around for more than 80 years. In that time span, there have been dozens of Native American players and hundreds of polynesians in the league. How many complained? How many refused to be part of the Redskins because they were offended?


First there are millions more black people in America than there are Native-Americans. A quick history lesson here. As I said before whites (rich whites) first tried to enslave the Native-Americans to do their work. But they kept getting sick and dying because of they weren't immune to European diseases. So when a slave ship from Africa on it's way to that Caribbean got ship wrecked in Virginia, that's when African slavery started in what is now the USA. Africans did more trading with Europeans and were immune to most of the deadly diseases because of that. Now because of the GENOCIDE committed here on the Native-Americans, they have since the beginning of the 20th century made up less than 5% of the population (and that's being very generous). Now they make up 1% of the overall population. 1% that's all. While the descendants of African slaves make up around 12-13% of the overall population. You're going to notice and hear 13% of something more than you will 1% of something. There are more black people and groups to make a stink about XYZ than there are Native-Americans. Then there is for years many Native-American tribes did not (and do not) consider themselves "Americans." They saw themselves as Sioux or Navajo, etc. But that's even a longer discussion all together. Now your claim that there have been dozens of Native-Americans who've played in the NFL, like who? How many Native-Americans have been Pro Bowlers and HoFers? How many N-A players of influence? I only know of two players off the top of my head. Jim Thorpe and Sam Bradford (who is only like 1/10th Native-American or something). Shit I have more Dutch blood in me than Bradford has Native-American blood in him. Compared to the number of black pro athletes to Native-American pro athletes, the number is not even close. So the black athletes will have more voices to express their displeasure over something. Plus there are more black consumers of pro sports than Native-American consumers. Meaning more blacks put their money into the NFL than Native-Americans do. Plus you know maybe if the U.S. hadn't killed millions of Native-Americans and not forced them onto reservations, there would be more of them today to complain about the Redskins' name. You know that old strength in numbers thing.

Quote

You know why? Cause it's not the same thing as having a team called the New York Ni99ers. You know how I know? Because if the Jets changed their name to the Ni99ers, no sane black athlete would play for that team and a few would probably try to kill Woody! Would Cam Newton play for the Carolina Coons? How about Russell Wilson getting drafted by the Seattle Porch Monkeys? NO NO and NO!!!!


Wonderful, another excuse for you to use the n-word. Any excuse right? Anyway, no black athlete would even get the chance to say they wouldn't play for the "New York N******." Because the second after Woody even thought about changing the name to that, he'd know he could never do it. The NAACP, the National Urban League, the SCLC and other blacks would raise hell. The other owners and Goodell wouldn't even let him send out that press release. He would be publicly ridiculed for even proposing that. Why? Because that word has been publicly unacceptable for decades, even longer in the north. Again there have been more blacks to make that word unacceptable than there is N-A's to make redskin unacceptable. There are black people all over this country. There are more people with a "black friend" or co-worker or classmate than there are people with a Native-American person in there life. Now I bet you're not going to go to a Indian reservation and call people there a redskin or a savage. Because it wouldn't be socially unacceptable there. But again because there are less of them to make a stink about the word "redskin" (unlike blacks and the n-word) and less of them in our daily lives, the name (though still racist) will stay. Until there is enough people to bitch about the redskin name and it's changed. But that's going to take many more discussions like this. And one way to create discussions like this is by people with influence (like members of congress for example) to bring this issue to national attention like it has. This is how change is made. More and more people paying attention to something and voicing displeasure over it to those in power. Then lobby those people in power to gather more attention and push for change. What is the Native-American version of the NAACP or Urban League (groups that lobby)? If they have one they are nowhere near as influential as the NAACP. Maybe if they had more members....oh yeah, their people were massively killed generations ago. That makes creating something like the Civil Rights Movement very difficult for them.

Quote

Polamalu is from American Samoa. He doesn't cut his goddamn dirty hair because it pay an "homage to his ancestry"... but not once did he say that the term "Redskins" is offensive nor did he ever sit out a game against them. That's my barometer for whether this is right or wrong. Not some politician trying to get his name into the papers.


So if Troy Polamalu doesn't stand up to Dan Snyder that must mean keeping that name is right? Maybe Troy is wrong for not speaking out and taking a stand. Or maybe he believes in Michael Jordan's philosophy for not taking a stand on certain issues or supporting certain people or things. Jordan allegedly said "Republicans buy shoes too." Maybe Troy feels if he spoke out there would be backlash that would hurt him professionally and financially. IDK. Does that make him a little complacent pussy? It might. Maybe he doesn't see himself (and Samoans) as a Native-American, maybe he hasn't given it much thought. Now that you bring it up, I'd like to know his opinion on the redskin slur being used as the Washington team's name still in 2013. Maybe he needs to be lobbied to take a stand. Then again we saw what happened when Chris Kluwe and Brandon Ayannadejo spoke out in favor of gay marriage rights. Some people said they should just shut up and not get involved in political matters. They were just football players and shouldn't talk about other stuff. Maybe that's why a star player like Polamalu doesn't speak out. He should IMO. Not just him, all players should. But he's grown up in an era in sports where athletes are told when they're in high school that they're just _____ball players and they shouldn't speak out. Because "Republicans buy shoes too," so don't do or say anything that would be bad for business. Just because Troy's been quite on this doesn't make it okay to stick with redskins as a team's name. You know that two wrongs don't make a right thing.

Okay, that's enough.
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View PostFlyHiJets, on 01 June 2013 - 08:35 PM, said:

You're the scumbag that thinks everyone should kiss the as$es of a bunch of criminals but I'm a dumbass. Yeah okay douchebag. Go give some illegal wetback or Revis another blowjob. But then again.....don't you live in an entirely different country but yet think you can tell us how to live? Go fvck yourself little boy. You're likely still living with mommy & daddy. Pu$$y.


View Postazjetfan, on 02 July 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

There are a few things I have realized about Mr. Jet over a few topics.

1) He is a racist. By constantly using race as a battling tool.
2) He is an extreme Liberal. If you are on either extreme you are probabaly more wrong than right.
3) He is one of those people who will never admit fault, error or defeat.
4)His life sucks and he takes it out on people who don't share in his views.
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#62 User is offline   SecondHandJets Icon

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:00 PM

Not. A. Single. Native. Or. Samoan. Player. Complained. About. The. Redskins. In. Their. 80+ Years. Of. Existence. Non. Issue.
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#63 User is offline   Mr_Jet Icon

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:14 PM

View PostSecondHandJets, on 30 May 2013 - 12:00 AM, said:

Not. A. Single. Native. Or. Samoan. Player. Complained. About. The. Redskins. In. Their. 80+ Years. Of. Existence. Non. Issue.


So? A lot of black people didn't complain about segregation for about 80 years. Especially the ones who lived in the north thousands of miles away from it. That didn't make it okay. Forget Samoans since many of them see themselves as Pacific Islanders or Asian (even though they're partly N-A IMO). How many Native-Americans from the continental U.S. have played in the NFL in that last 80 years? Tell me that number. They're the ones being depicted in the Redskins logo. It's their heritage we're talking about here, not the ones in the Pacific.
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View PostFlyHiJets, on 01 June 2013 - 08:35 PM, said:

You're the scumbag that thinks everyone should kiss the as$es of a bunch of criminals but I'm a dumbass. Yeah okay douchebag. Go give some illegal wetback or Revis another blowjob. But then again.....don't you live in an entirely different country but yet think you can tell us how to live? Go fvck yourself little boy. You're likely still living with mommy & daddy. Pu$$y.


View Postazjetfan, on 02 July 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

There are a few things I have realized about Mr. Jet over a few topics.

1) He is a racist. By constantly using race as a battling tool.
2) He is an extreme Liberal. If you are on either extreme you are probabaly more wrong than right.
3) He is one of those people who will never admit fault, error or defeat.
4)His life sucks and he takes it out on people who don't share in his views.
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#64 User is online   santana Icon

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:35 PM

To quote Bugs bunny
Y'all muthafuckas betta know
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#65 User is offline   SecondHandJets Icon

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:45 PM

View PostMr_Jet, on 30 May 2013 - 12:14 AM, said:

How many Native-Americans from the continental U.S. have played in the NFL in that last 80 years? Tell me that number. They're the ones being depicted in the Redskins logo. It's their heritage we're talking about here, not the ones in the Pacific.


I only know of a few, but some of them are outspoken... like Wes Welker. That guy had a whole schtick about Rex's feet but never complained about the Redskins somehow infringing on his Cherokee rights.
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#66 User is offline   Mr_Jet Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 12:23 AM

View PostSecondHandJets, on 30 May 2013 - 12:45 AM, said:

I only know of a few, but some of them are outspoken... like Wes Welker. That guy had a whole schtick about Rex's feet but never complained about the Redskins somehow infringing on his Cherokee rights.


Did you really just try to compare those two things? IDK maybe you're right. I know when I think of a modern day Muhammad Ali or Jim Brown (or Peter Norman if you want a white guy) I automatically think of Wes Welker. :rolleyes:/>

This is how the 2010 U.S. census listed our racial makeup options.

Posted Image

As you can see "American Indian" and "Samoan" have different listings. I wonder which box Troy Polamalu put an X in when he filled it out? I'm thinking not American Indian. I still think he and all others should speak out though.

The Tennessee Oilers changed their names to the Titans because fans thought calling them the Oilers didn't make sense, since oil drilling was a Texas thing and not a Tennessee thing. Bud Adams wasn't concerned about his "brand" for his million/billion dollar business. They could have remained the Tennessee Oilers. That was just about 15 years ago. That name change happened the same year Dan Snyder bought the Redskins BTW.
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View PostFlyHiJets, on 01 June 2013 - 08:35 PM, said:

You're the scumbag that thinks everyone should kiss the as$es of a bunch of criminals but I'm a dumbass. Yeah okay douchebag. Go give some illegal wetback or Revis another blowjob. But then again.....don't you live in an entirely different country but yet think you can tell us how to live? Go fvck yourself little boy. You're likely still living with mommy & daddy. Pu$$y.


View Postazjetfan, on 02 July 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

There are a few things I have realized about Mr. Jet over a few topics.

1) He is a racist. By constantly using race as a battling tool.
2) He is an extreme Liberal. If you are on either extreme you are probabaly more wrong than right.
3) He is one of those people who will never admit fault, error or defeat.
4)His life sucks and he takes it out on people who don't share in his views.
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#67 User is online   santana Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 12:52 AM


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Posted 30 May 2013 - 06:16 AM

Secondhands, you're being a dick and you know it. Because you get your jollies off being a dick. Anyone being half way reasonable knows the name Redskins is offensive and there is no good reason to keep that name. Your whole argument that more people don't vocally oppose the name is ridiculous. If you study even a modicum of history you'll know things take time and strong, brave people to change. What we need is a strong person to oppose the Redskins name.
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#69 User is offline   SecondHandJets Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 08:33 AM

View PostMr_Jet, on 30 May 2013 - 01:23 AM, said:

As you can see "American Indian" and "Samoan" have different listings. I wonder which box Troy Polamalu put an X in when he filled it out? I'm thinking not American Indian. I still think he and all others should speak out though.


The reason why I brought up American Samoa is because this letter that we are arguing about was written by the American Samoa Congressman. Obviously since it came from his office, it must reflect the views of his constituents, right? Since that's what his job is... I mean why else would an American Samoan write a letter asking Snyder to rename the Redskins if it didn't offend American Samoans?! Polamalu is a very proud American Samoan who is a high profile long tenured All Pro. I just brought him up as an example since you're so keen on show & tell.


View PostMr_Jet, on 30 May 2013 - 01:23 AM, said:

The Tennessee Oilers changed their names to the Titans because fans thought calling them the Oilers didn't make sense, since oil drilling was a Texas thing and not a Tennessee thing. Bud Adams wasn't concerned about his "brand" for his million/billion dollar business. They could have remained the Tennessee Oilers. That was just about 15 years ago. That name change happened the same year Dan Snyder bought the Redskins BTW.


You're so cute when you try to grasp on to straws. Bud Adams changed the name not because "it didn't make sense". There's more sense to the Tennessee Oilers then there is to the LA Lakers or the Utah Jazz or Arizona Cardinals or Memphis Grizzlies. Bud Adams changed the name because the first year in Tennessee, the team drew 18,000 per game. That's right. For an NFL game. He completely had to change his brand so Tenesseeans would adopt the team. Believe me if he had started with sold out stadiums, we'd still be calling then the Oilers.

BTW, since you want me to keep naming Native Americans, Bud Adams is Cherokee. So there you go, an OWNER who should be sitting next to Snyder at the owner meetings and pushing for a change... right? I mean since it's soooooo offensive!
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Posted 30 May 2013 - 10:03 AM

Burp!! this thread has become lame. ♂
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Posted 30 May 2013 - 02:59 PM

Congress & the rest of the little b!tch whiners need to find better things to do with their time. I'm 1/4 Cherokee and I don't find it offensive. Anyone that does and that is not native, go fvck yourselves. I'm so sick & tired of this "political correct" bull$hit in this country it's a sin. No wonder Americans get attacked at every chance. Congress and Obozo have turned the country into a bunch of pu$$ies.
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Posted 30 May 2013 - 03:21 PM

View PostFlyHiJets, on 30 May 2013 - 03:59 PM, said:

Congress & the rest of the little b!tch whiners need to find better things to do with their time. I'm 1/4 Cherokee and I don't find it offensive. Anyone that does and that is not native, go fvck yourselves. I'm so sick & tired of this "political correct" bull$hit in this country it's a sin. No wonder Americans get attacked at every chance. Congress and Obozo have turned the country into a bunch of pu$$ies.


Please post a picture of yourself with a feather in your hair. Mr Jet must visually inspect you. Lets hope you look more Cherokee than Wes Welker, who's Native American roots were rebuffed by the Council (of one) Race Relations on NYJFan.com.
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Posted 30 May 2013 - 03:35 PM

View PostSecondHandJets, on 30 May 2013 - 09:33 AM, said:

The reason why I brought up American Samoa is because this letter that we are arguing about was written by the American Samoa Congressman. Obviously since it came from his office, it must reflect the views of his constituents, right? Since that's what his job is... I mean why else would an American Samoan write a letter asking Snyder to rename the Redskins if it didn't offend American Samoans?! Polamalu is a very proud American Samoan who is a high profile long tenured All Pro. I just brought him up as an example since you're so keen on show & tell.


So? People in American Samoa and Native Hawaiians and Native Eskimos can't relate to having a bunch of "paleskins" coming and taking over their land? As I said all he can pretty much do is lobby others since he can't vote on bills. My congressman is Republican and there have been many times when I knew he wouldn't support something I did support. So I wrote/lobbied other congressmen/women. Just a few months ago I wrote (along with a group of others) Senator Kaine from Virginia. I'm not his constituent, but he still wrote me back though. So just because this delegate from American Samoa doesn't have a lot of Iroquois for example as his constituents doesn't mean he only has to listen to his constituents and ignore people from other parts of the country. Representatives, delegates, and senators do have the ability to focus on more than one thing at a time.

Also Eni Faleomavaega (the delegate who released the letter) is on committees like the Committee on Natural Resources, Subcommittee on Energy and Mineral Resources, Subcommittee on Fisheries, Wildlife, Oceans and Insular Affairs. Things that have historically been a major concern to Native-Americans. So he has likely corresponded and worked with many Native-American groups over the years. BTW, both black and white members of the House signed on to that letter too. And you still haven't showed or told me any names of the MANY Native-Americans that have played in the NFL in the last 80 years. I want some players who would've marked that American Indian box on the census. People who don't likely consider themselves to be Asian-American (like Polamalu).

From NNDB:

Quote

Troy Polamalu

AKA Troy Benjamin Aumua

Born: 19-Apr-1981
Birthplace: Garden Grove, CA

Gender: Male
Religion: Greek Orthodox
Race or Ethnicity: Asian
Sexual orientation: Straight
Occupation: Football

Nationality: United States
Executive summary: Pittsburgh Steelers



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You're so cute when you try to grasp on to straws. Bud Adams changed the name not because "it didn't make sense". There's more sense to the Tennessee Oilers then there is to the LA Lakers or the Utah Jazz or Arizona Cardinals or Memphis Grizzlies. Bud Adams changed the name because the first year in Tennessee, the team drew 18,000 per game. That's right. For an NFL game. He completely had to change his brand so Tenesseeans would adopt the team. Believe me if he had started with sold out stadiums, we'd still be calling then the Oilers.


Have Lakers, Jazz, Cardinals, and Grizzlies fans called for their teams to change their names like Oilers/Titans fans did in the 90s?

"Owner K.S. "Bud" Adams, Jr., listens to the Tennessee fans and announces that he will change the name of the team. An advisory council is later formed to research names and a "Guess the Name" contest is introduced to fans to gain additional feedback."
Tennessee Titans|History 1990's'

Why else would the fans ask for a name change? Because they felt Oilers didn't fit with Tennessee. That is something that is known for being in Texas, not Tennessee. Fans in Tennessee apparently cared more than Utah Jazz fans did that their team's name didn't fit. So Bud Adams decided to change the teams name and let the fans pick the name. The Washington Bullets became the Wizards because their owner didn't want the team associated with gun violence. It wasn't appropriate to have that name because of the gun violence all over the world.

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Delgardo Franklin – District Heights, MD: I'm a life-long Bullets/ Wizards Fan. What was the rationale, if any, for the team name change?

Abe Pollin: It has been awhile since I have been asked this question. Believe me when I say it was not an easy decision. I won a World Championship under the name Bullets. However, too often during the mid to late ‘90s, I would hear the word “bullets” associated with guns and violence instead of my basketball team. While the name was longstanding, I finally reached a point that I was simply tired of the association between the two. Then, my good friend, Prime Minister Rabin was assassinated in Israel. That was the final straw. It was time to change names. With regard to the name “Wizards,” we held a three-tiered contest to determine a new name. The name “Wizards” was selected by the fans and has adorned our uniforms since that time.


It's time for Daniel Snyder to tire of the association between the word redskins and his football team like Abe Pollin did with the Bullets name. If Bud Adams can change a name just because the fans wanted him to, Snyder can do it too. And Snyder has a better reason to change the name than Adams did.

And Adams didn't change the name because "he completely had to change his brand so Tennesseans would adopt the team." First the reason they only drew 18,000 a game is because for their first season in Tennessee the Oilers played in Memphis. Memphis fans were pissed off because after trying to get a NFL team for years, they'd only get the Oilers for two years until they moved to Nashville after their new stadium was built. Memphis didn't want to support a team that would be leaving in two years anyway and Nashville fans didn't want to drive 200 miles to see a "home" game. They might as well go see a Falcons game if they were going to drive over 200 miles to see a NFL game. Them being a mediocre 8-8 didn't help matters either. The name change didn't have shit to do with getting Tennessee fans to adopt the team. The fans called for the name change and so Bud Adams said let's change the name.

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Stuck in a state of apathy Oilers: The NFL team has been given the cold shoulder from Memphis and, more surprisingly, has received a lukewarm reception in Nashville, where the club will move for good in 1999.

September 19, 1997|By Ken Murray | Ken Murray,SUN STAFF

Pepper Rodgers is no stranger to the hard sell and Memphis, Tenn.

Once, as coach of the U.S. Football League's Showboats in the mid-1980s, he sold springtime football as a viable alternative to the NFL. A decade later in a similar role, he pitched Mad Dogs and the Canadian Football League to the discerning populace in western Tennessee.

Now, though, comes the most chilling and challenging sales job of Rodgers' football life.

He is trying to promote the Tennessee Oilers in the city the NFL spurned four years ago in expansion. He's trying to fill the Liberty Bowl's 62,380 seats against the knowledge this is strictly a short-term, albeit expensive, arrangement.

After two decades of lusting for an NFL team, it has come to this in Memphis: The city is baby-sitting the Oilers for two years until the team's new stadium in Nashville can be completed.

And this: On Sunday against the Ravens, in only their second home game in Tennessee, the Oilers are expecting -- well, hoping for -- a crowd of 20,000. That's if they get a brisk walk-up sale.

Make no mistake, Memphians are not thrilled with their role in the Texas two-step out of Houston.

"I don't think it's the Oilers that people are mad at," Rodgers said. "I think it's the NFL more than anything."

Rodgers, 65, defines his role with the Oilers as trouble-shooter in Memphis. So far, the Oilers have kept him busy with a scorching trail of brush fires.

Like the one this week, when Oilers defensive linemen Josh Evans and Anthony Cook were scheduled to attend a news conference in Memphis to promote Sunday's game. But Monday's practice ran long, and Evans and Cook missed their flight out of Nashville. Not surprisingly, news spots with Rodgers have gone past stale in Memphis.

"We have no presence here," he said of the Oilers. "It is so hard. They don't want to hear me in Memphis, they want to hear the players."

The Oilers' road to Tennessee is littered with oversights, poor calculations and terrible judgment. A sampling of their mistakes: When Oilers owner Bud Adams reached a two-year agreement to play regular-season games in the Liberty Bowl, he requested travel expenses to take the team back and forth from Nashville. ** Only he asked that those expenses be paid by the folks in Memphis. This affront was not well-received, and after a severe backlash, Adams withdrew his request.

Adams initially said he would change the Oilers' name and let Tennessee fans choose a new one. But then he changed his mind on changing the name, and that spawned more controversy.

In a college market that supported the USFL and CFL in varying degrees, the Oilers implemented the second-highest increase in average ticket price in the NFL. Their average ticket jumped 28.8 percent to $40.36, second only to the Washington Redskins' increase of 48.3 percent to $52.92, according to the Team Marketing Report, a Chicago newsletter.

Combine all that with the late start -- the Oilers weren't able to sell tickets until late June after their move -- and it's not hard to see there would be problems.

Yet, incredibly, the team had no inkling of the resentment of the NFL that awaited it in Memphis. This is a city that jumped through NFL hoops for two decades, playing host to 14 exhibition games during that time, in an attempt to get an expansion team, only to be rejected twice.

Don MacLachlan, the Oilers' senior vice president whose duties recently were expanded to include overseeing the Memphis operations, said no one from the league cautioned Adams that playing games in a city spurned during expansion might not be a good idea.

"No [they didn't]," MacLachlan said, "and I guess some of our marketing research shows a lot of avid football fans still in Memphis and surrounding communities. By the time we were able to hit the ground running and sell tickets, a lot of people had committed to college games and weren't able to commit to season tickets.

"We knew the situation we were in in regard to Memphis [not] getting an expansion team. I don't think there was any way we could gauge what was going to transpire, or what has transpired."

Even though the team has played well in splitting two overtime games, ticket sales have been nothing short of disastrous. A crowd of 30,171 turned out for the Oilers' Tennessee debut on Aug. 31, a rousing 24-21 victory against the Oakland Raiders. Projections were for crowds of between 50,000 and 55,000.

Only 10,000 season tickets have been sold, and only 4,000 of those went to Nashville fans willing to make the three-hour-plus drive to Memphis.

Additionally, only 27 of the Liberty Bowl's 40 skyboxes were sold. Clearly, skybox revenue was one of the big reasons Adams chose to play in Memphis rather than at Vanderbilt University in Nashville.

Even Nashville has been shockingly lukewarm to the Oilers' arrival. In two preseason games at Vanderbilt, the Oilers drew an average of 23,065 fans. Television ratings for the Oilers' 16-13 loss at Miami in Week 2 were modest, too. The team had a 13.2 rating with a 31 share in Nashville, and an 11.0/21 in Memphis.

The frustration is beginning to surface with a team that believed it had left apathy behind in Houston (the Oilers averaged 31,825 fans in last year's lame-duck season). After winning the home opener, running back Eddie George said he was puzzled by the low turnout in Memphis.

"I'm not a politician, I'm a ballplayer," he said. "We're the Tennessee Oilers. We represent the whole state of Tennessee, not just Nashville."

In a conference call with Baltimore reporters this week, George's frustration became more apparent.

"I think Jeff [Fisher] is a great coach and a great motivator," George said. "He's done a great job of getting us together in the midst of all this madness the last year or so.

"This is only temporary. It will not happen the next five, six years. Hopefully not."

Said Fisher: "If anyone followed Memphis, they would understand their plight. To a certain extent, there is some frustration. We feel like in anything, winning should bring people around."

Ross Bartow, executive director of the newly created Memphis Sports Authority, cited ticket prices and the Oilers' request for travel expenses as factors contributing to the slow start. But the biggest problem, he said, was the city's pain over not getting an expansion team.

"I found it surprising just how deep the NFL scars were in this city," Bartow said. "It surprised people who have been here all their lives."

R. C. Johnson, athletic director at the University of Memphis, shares the Liberty Bowl with the Oilers. The Tigers averaged 38,000 fans last year.

"My theory is, if it was the Dallas Cowboys here, I think the [stadium] would be full," Johnson said. "Or the [San Francisco] 49ers. That would supersede all the other stuff. There's not a whole lot of loyalty to the Oilers to begin with, not a lot of magnetism to them."

There will be plenty of competition for Memphis' entertainment dollar this weekend, though. The Tigers play Minnesota tomorrow night, and the Mid-South Fair at the fairgrounds runs through the weekend.

Even though only some 3,000 non-season ticket holders have purchased tickets for the NFL game, the Ravens won't have to take a hit in their share of the visitor's gate receipts. Ravens spokesman Kevin Byrne said that Adams has a guarantee in place for visiting teams until the Oilers move to Nashville.

Despite the ominous start, the Oilers refuse to panic.

"We have a two-year agreement with the Liberty Bowl," MacLachlan said. "I would say it's not a true barometer for the entire season. We'll let a little more time go on to evaluate things, rather than base it on two games early in the year."


As you see the Oilers/Titans had a lot of problems that first year in Tennessee that caused them to only sell 18,000 seats a game. It had more to do with Memphis vs. Nashville than Tennesseans (Memphis and Nashville) not adopting the "brand."


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BTW, since you want me to keep naming Native Americans, Bud Adams is Cherokee. So there you go, an OWNER who should be sitting next to Snyder at the owner meetings and pushing for a change... right? I mean since it's soooooo offensive!


With your way of thinking if I beat the shit out of two innocent people and they don't complain about it, then that must make what I did alright. Bud Adams is Cherokee and a NFL owner. Good, he is the perfect person to lobby Dan Snyder to change the name. Or maybe Adams is a sellout. I don't know. Maybe he has lobbied Snyder privately to change the name. I hope he has or will before he dies. But just because Bud Adams hasn't been vocal in public doesn't mean that the Redskins name should stay. It doesn't mean keeping the name is cool. Just because somebody keeps quite about something that is wrong, doesn't mean that wrong thing is okay. Wrong is still wrong.
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View PostFlyHiJets, on 01 June 2013 - 08:35 PM, said:

You're the scumbag that thinks everyone should kiss the as$es of a bunch of criminals but I'm a dumbass. Yeah okay douchebag. Go give some illegal wetback or Revis another blowjob. But then again.....don't you live in an entirely different country but yet think you can tell us how to live? Go fvck yourself little boy. You're likely still living with mommy & daddy. Pu$$y.


View Postazjetfan, on 02 July 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

There are a few things I have realized about Mr. Jet over a few topics.

1) He is a racist. By constantly using race as a battling tool.
2) He is an extreme Liberal. If you are on either extreme you are probabaly more wrong than right.
3) He is one of those people who will never admit fault, error or defeat.
4)His life sucks and he takes it out on people who don't share in his views.
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#74 User is offline   Mr_Jet Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:02 PM

View PostFlyHiJets, on 30 May 2013 - 03:59 PM, said:

Congress & the rest of the little b!tch whiners need to find better things to do with their time. I'm 1/4 Cherokee and I don't find it offensive. Anyone that does and that is not native, go fvck yourselves. I'm so sick & tired of this "political correct" bull$hit in this country it's a sin. No wonder Americans get attacked at every chance. Congress and Obozo have turned the country into a bunch of pu$$ies.


This coming from the guy how advocates shooting illegal immigrant's babies in the head. Always the voice of calm and reason.
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View PostFlyHiJets, on 01 June 2013 - 08:35 PM, said:

You're the scumbag that thinks everyone should kiss the as$es of a bunch of criminals but I'm a dumbass. Yeah okay douchebag. Go give some illegal wetback or Revis another blowjob. But then again.....don't you live in an entirely different country but yet think you can tell us how to live? Go fvck yourself little boy. You're likely still living with mommy & daddy. Pu$$y.


View Postazjetfan, on 02 July 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

There are a few things I have realized about Mr. Jet over a few topics.

1) He is a racist. By constantly using race as a battling tool.
2) He is an extreme Liberal. If you are on either extreme you are probabaly more wrong than right.
3) He is one of those people who will never admit fault, error or defeat.
4)His life sucks and he takes it out on people who don't share in his views.
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#75 User is offline   Tebow15 Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:09 PM

Redskins is as offensive to Native Americans as the "N" word is to black people, and no that is not just my opinion. The team should have fixed this a long time ago. People have been trying for DECADES to change this, but without success. They have been successful on the college front, most schools with Native American names changed their team mascots, but the Redskins have had way too much money to fight.

So before anyone goes around saying that this is overraction, see how happy you would be with a team named the "N" words or any slur against hispanics, latinos, or anyone of European or Asian descent. Its a spit in the face of a race that has suffered just as much, probably more so, than any other race in American history.
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#76 User is offline   Mr_Jet Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:10 PM

View PostSecondHandJets, on 30 May 2013 - 04:21 PM, said:

Please post a picture of yourself with a feather in your hair. Mr Jet must visually inspect you. Lets hope you look more Cherokee than Wes Welker, who's Native American roots were rebuffed by the Council (of one) Race Relations on NYJFan.com.


I'm 1/4th Dutch, so? Does that mean I have to go around wearing wooden shoes? Considering many Native-American were forced to assimilate there are probably millions of Americans (black, white, Latino, and Asian) who are (or think they are) 1/8th Hopi or 1/16th Sioux or some fraction of something. You act like everybody who is some fraction Native-American today marched on the Trail of Tears or some shit. Obama and Cheney are cousins too. We're all mongrels.
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View PostFlyHiJets, on 01 June 2013 - 08:35 PM, said:

You're the scumbag that thinks everyone should kiss the as$es of a bunch of criminals but I'm a dumbass. Yeah okay douchebag. Go give some illegal wetback or Revis another blowjob. But then again.....don't you live in an entirely different country but yet think you can tell us how to live? Go fvck yourself little boy. You're likely still living with mommy & daddy. Pu$$y.


View Postazjetfan, on 02 July 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

There are a few things I have realized about Mr. Jet over a few topics.

1) He is a racist. By constantly using race as a battling tool.
2) He is an extreme Liberal. If you are on either extreme you are probabaly more wrong than right.
3) He is one of those people who will never admit fault, error or defeat.
4)His life sucks and he takes it out on people who don't share in his views.
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#77 User is offline   HarlemHxC814 Icon

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:58 PM

View PostTebow15, on 30 May 2013 - 05:09 PM, said:

Redskins is as offensive to Native Americans as the "N" word is to black people, and no that is not just my opinion. The team should have fixed this a long time ago. People have been trying for DECADES to change this, but without success. They have been successful on the college front, most schools with Native American names changed their team mascots, but the Redskins have had way too much money to fight.

So before anyone goes around saying that this is overraction, see how happy you would be with a team named the "N" words or any slur against hispanics, latinos, or anyone of European or Asian descent. Its a spit in the face of a race that has suffered just as much, probably more so, than any other race in American history.


I uh...agree with Clemens11
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#78 User is offline   HurricaneJet32 Icon

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 07:38 AM

View PostHarlemHxC814, on 30 May 2013 - 08:58 PM, said:

I uh...agree with Clemens11


The TEH in your sig made me spit up my orange juice. Thank you.
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#79 User is offline   HarlemHxC814 Icon

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 07:43 AM

View PostHurricaneJet32, on 31 May 2013 - 08:38 AM, said:

The TEH in your sig made me spit up my orange juice. Thank you.


:victory:
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#80 User is offline   MlorinczJ Icon

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 12:08 PM

View PostSecondHandJets, on 29 May 2013 - 09:53 PM, said:

Not sure how broad a scope you want me to research. The commerce clause exists so government can keep up with evolving business and industry and take action when an industry starts acting in an unlawful manner. Like the Sherman Anti Trust Act and stopping business from descriminating in the 60s. It cannot stress that a business in a lawful industry not in violation of any laws be forced to change its brand because it's deemed offensive. There's absolutely no precedent for it.


"There are three broad categories of activity that Congress may regulate under its commerce power: use of channels of interstate commerce; protection of instrumentalities of interstate commerce or persons or things in interstate commerce; and regulation of those activities having substantial relation to interstate commerce."

Goetz v. Glickman, 920 F. Supp. 1173 (D. Kan. 1996) aff'd, 149 F.3d 1131 (10th Cir. 1998).

"Commerce clause has long been seen as . . . [an] affirmative grant of congressional authority."

Fulton Corp. v. Faulkner, 516 U.S. 325 (U.S.N.C. 1996).

"Power of Congress over interstate commerce is the power to regulate, that is, to prescribe the rule by which commerce is to be governed, which power, like others vested in Congress, is complete in itself, may be exercised to its utmost extent, and acknowledges no limitations other than are prescribed in the constitution."

N. Am. Co. v. Sec. & Exch. Comm'n, 327 U.S. 686 (1946).


There's no stipulation in the commerce clause about businesses acting in a "lawful" or "unlawful" manner. The fact is that Congress can use the commerce clause to create regulations where they do not exist, if they see fit.
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